Cincy Jungle: An SB Nation Community

Navigation: Jump to content areas:


Pro Quality. Fan Perspective.
Around SBN: Headlines: BC Beats BU 4-3 in 58th Beanpot Championship

In his last 21 starts, Carson Palmer is 7-14. Question of the Day: Is Carson Palmer still an elite NFL quarterback or is he a victim of circumstance?

Cincinnati Bengals quarterback Carson Palmer passes the ball during the team's practice at NFL football training camp, Friday, July 31, 2009, in Georgetown, Ky. (AP Photo/Al Behrman)

More photos » Al Behrman - AP

6 months ago: Cincinnati Bengals quarterback Carson Palmer passes the ball during the team's practice at NFL football training camp, Friday, July 31, 2009, in Georgetown, Ky. (AP Photo/Al Behrman)

We're not here to pile on Carson Palmer. We still believe that he gives the Bengals offense the best chance to succeed. As Jake points out in his morning briefing, Bengals.com beat writer Geoff Hobson wrote "Not only is Palmer is 7-17 in his last 24 starts, but when is it going to get any better?" Lance McAlister implied the same thing, jotting down Palmer's last ten starts. Paul Daugherty writes, "Feel free to wonder if C. Palmer will ever be the guy he was in '05 and '06."

Let me make this disclaimer right now: Palmer is far from the problem on this offense; everything added up equates to a single problem; the inability to score points (Bengals have scored 30 or more points, four times since 2007). His performance against the Denver Broncos, while solid in the mind's of game managers, could be attributed to less-than-stellar blocking, penalties and dropped passes and he wasn't without his own criticisms. For instance, Palmer completed only five of 12 passes on third down for 67 yards passing and an interception (25.3 passer rating). On the other hand, four of those incomplete passes were attributed to drops by Laveranues Coles. So the disclaimer applies. While we could focus on one thing, you have to acknowledge everything else.

So we're fully aware. Palmer is 1/11th part of the issue here.

Star-divide

However, I did want to take a look at Palmer's recent performances, based on the question if Palmer is the same quarterback since his 2005 and 2006 glory years; as prompted by the above links. Or is that too simplified, without pointing out that the offensive line in 2005 and 2006 was far superior than the offensive line we've had since -- aka, having Eric Steinbach, Rich Braham (in 2005) and Levi Jones and Willie Anderson playing at the top of their game. I won't argue against that -- and I believe that any doesn't acknowledge the above while implying their criticisms is doing a disservice to Palmer. Would you hate me if we discarded all of that and simply looked at Palmer's performances?

Since 2007.

Date Opp Result Att Comp Yard TD INT Rating
9.13.09 Denver L, 7-12 33 21 247 0 2 61.0
10.5.08 Dallas L, 22-31 39 23 217 2 1 80.8
9.21.08 NY Giants L, 23-26 39 27 286 1 0 98.9
9.14.08 Tennessee L, 7-24 27 16 134 0 2 41.3
9.7.08 Baltimore L, 10-17 9 24 94 0 1 32.3
12.30.07 Miami W, 38-25 32 23 316 3 1 121.4
12.23.07 Cleveland W, 19-14 21 11 115 1 2 44.8
12.15.07 San Francisco L, 13-20 31 19 252 1 0 97.8
12.9.07 St. Louis W, 19-10 29 21 189 0 2 60.8
12.2.07 Pittsburgh L, 10-24 44 17 183 0 0 51.6
11.25.07 Tennessee W, 35-6 38 32 283 3 1 113.0
11.18.07 Arizona L, 27-35 52 37 329 2 4 68.5
11.11.07 Baltimore W, 21-7 34 23 271 0 0 91.7
11.4.07 Buffalo L, 21-33 39 26 271 2 1 93.0
10.28.07 Pittsburgh L, 13-24 31 23 205 1 0 102.2
10.21.07 NY Jets W, 38-31 21 14 226 1 1 98.5
10.14.07 Kansas City L, 20-27 43 26 320 2 2 79.6
10.1.07 New England L, 13-34 35 21 234 1 2 65.7
9.23.07 Seattle L, 21-24 43 27 342 1 2 75.9
9.16.07 Cleveland L, 45-51 50 33 401 6 2 113.4
9.10.07 Baltimore W, 27-20 32 20 194 2 0 100.3
      722 484 5,109 29 26 85.8
      34.4 23.0 243.3 1.4 1.2 85.8

The one thing that jumps out at you immediately is that the Bengals are 7-14 in the last 21 games that Palmer has started; including only one stretch of back-to-back wins -- one of those games was against the 1-14 Miami Dolphins. You have to go all the way back to week 13 and 14 in 2006 to find the next back-to-back wins by the Bengals when Palmer starts. Of Palmer's 21 most recent starts, he's recorded five games with a passer rating of 100 points or more -- his most recent triple-digit passer rating came on December 30, 2007. He's failed to record a touchdown pass in five of his past ten starts -- thrown a pick in seven of his past ten.

Again. I'm not piling on. I believe that Palmer's recent performances are within a larger view of the problems the Cincinnati offense is having; not just Palmer, but everyone. For example, let's examine the team's rushing performance in games that Palmer starts.

Date Opp Result Att Yards Avg/Att TDs
9.13.09 Denver L, 7-12 27 86 3.2 1
10.5.08 Dallas L, 22-31 23 61 2.7 0
9.21.08 NY Giants L, 23-26 27 102 3.8 1
9.14.08 Tennessee L, 7-24 27 88 3.1 1
9.7.08 Baltimore L, 10-17 24 70 2.9 0
12.30.07 Miami W, 38-25 24 77 3.2 1
12.23.07 Cleveland W, 19-14 33 155 4.7 1
12.15.07 San Francisco L, 13-20 19 61 3.2 0
12.9.07 St. Louis W, 19-10 36 192 5.3 1
12.2.07 Pittsburgh L, 10-24 23 74 3.2 1
11.25.07 Tennessee W, 35-6 36 148 4.1 2
11.18.07 Arizona L, 27-35 20 72 3.6 0
11.11.07 Baltimore W, 21-7 34 70 2.1 0
11.4.07 Buffalo L, 21-33 17 28 1.6 0
10.28.07 Pittsburgh L, 13-24 21 91 4.3 0
10.21.07 NY Jets W, 38-31 41 177 4.3 3
10.14.07 Kansas City L, 20-27 18 78 4.3 0
10.1.07 New England L, 13-34 15 57 3.8 0
9.23.07 Seattle L, 21-24 30 84 2.8 1
9.16.07 Cleveland L, 45-51 26 137 5.3 0
9.10.07 Baltimore W, 27-20 23 55 2.4 0
      544 1,963 3.61 13
      25.9 93.5 3.61 0.62

In Palmer's last 21 starts, the Bengals rushing offense eclipsed the 100-yard mark six times. They haven't achieved a rushing average of more than four yards-per-rush since beating Cleveland on December 23, 2007.

So the question of the day is: What do you think about Carson Palmer? Has he lost it since his glory days in 2005? Or is he the victim of a cast of characters that degraded around him? If I'm answering the question (which I am), I believe that Palmer is a victim of bad circumstance; injury; lack of supporting personnel, etc.. I believe that if Palmer of today played with the team in 2005, he'd be just as good if not better.

I want to know your impressions.

0 recs  |  Comment 49 comments |

Story-email Email Printer Print

Comments

Display:

If anyone wonders if Palmer is still a top-tier talent or not,

I would refer you to yesterday’s final drive. When the plycalling is aggressive and the blocking is adequate, the man took the ball effortlessly 91 yards going 5 for 5 on the drive. Carson Palmer is not the problem.

That said, if Tony Pike keeps looking the way he has the past two weeks I’d give him a look in April as our QB of the future and to lock down the backup role until Palmer is no longer a Bengal.

by A Pragmatic Bengals Fan on Sep 14, 2009 2:03 PM EDT via mobile reply actions   0 recs

I'd, just once, like to see him...

Throwing behind an actual NFL-quality offensive line. Not one that breaks down on blitzes time and time again.

by IFChris on Sep 14, 2009 2:05 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

+1

He did in 05 when we had great lineman
he’s not the problem over the years it’s the o line
we lost steinbach which was stupid
Willie Anderson got too old
rich braham retired
levi jones started to get hurt
and we didn’t do anything to replace them..we just tried to get their backups to replace em

by ak513 on Sep 14, 2009 6:06 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

i like tony pike as well, but i’m not convinced that he’s not a system quarterback.

by Raging Clue on Sep 14, 2009 9:55 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Really, though, isn't everyone a system quarterback?

Just depends on what system you’re running and how similar it is to the player’s college system. :)

by A Pragmatic Bengals Fan on Sep 15, 2009 12:03 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions   0 recs

my point is, he’s going to be hard-pressed to find an nfl team running a spread offense.

by Raging Clue on Sep 15, 2009 8:51 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I think.

Once the health issues are behind him — which seemed like they largely were yesterday — and he gets back into rhythm and the rest of the offense pulls their head out of their collective asses and runs more effectively and doesn’t drop passes, he’ll be back there. It’s going to take time though

Blogger at CincyJungle.com -- SB Nation Cincinnati Bengals blog.

by Kirkendall on Sep 14, 2009 2:05 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

It will take time...

…and an intelligent OC.

If the one we got suddenly grows a brain, great.

If not…

by FriarBob on Sep 14, 2009 7:59 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

We will know by mid-season

The offense is healthy enough and the rust should be off by now. We have too many possible weapons for us to score 10 points or less. Next two games should be hard but I’d expect them to win at least one, good teams beat good opponents. If we lose to the Browns then we suck. Coaches also have to realize we are a passing team, not running, why else would we have an ‘elite’ QB.

by CincyRed on Sep 14, 2009 2:12 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Only One Down

While I had the feeling the whole game that something incredi-bull would happen to lose the game, the fact is that the offense was just stagnant. Can’t say it was all Carson, but he contributed. What do you expect when he’s played what, two quarters in four games?
Who in their right mind puts the guy in when he ain’t played recently. The fact is the team is losing their credibility when it comes to Carson and his “Elite” status. Put the QB job up for the best man to win and Carson will mysteriously rise to the occasion. Guaranteed!

midnight crusader

by Drofintellact on Sep 14, 2009 2:29 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

I don't think he's the cause but...

after the two big injuries and the year he threw a crap load of picks, I think he got way to conservative. “Elite” QB’s take charge and win the game at any cost. Either him or the offense as a whole (Brat) refuse to take chances. When we face a cover 2 defense, we have no answer for it. The best way I can sum it up is that we don’t play to win. We play not to lose.

by smoormandiddy on Sep 14, 2009 2:56 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

A few thoughts on the WRs, and thus, the QB

1. Andre Caldwell is the 3rd down receiver we thought Coles would be.
2. Coles is not the 3rd down receiver – Palmer relied heavily on him on 3rd downs, and 4 dropped balls on 3rd is over 50% of the failed 3rd down conversions
3. That offensive pass interference on Chad was the most outrageous BS too-tight call by the ump. BUT, they called the same thing later when Broncos did it. Tightly officiated game. Oh, and it was just 1 game, not the whole season, NOR is it “the season as a microcosm”. Just 1 game. Now
4. Chad played great. Loved his intensity, blocked in the 3rd qtr on runs, but I didn’t look for it in the 4th qtr. Haven’t seen him block in a while. He’s being the consumate team player. Soak it up. He’s gonna be what Chad and Housh were COMBINED last year.

by Yaccub Fleishcman on Sep 14, 2009 3:22 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

get a grip

Why would anyone even suggest that Carson Palmer is a weak link? This is nuts. One bizarre, fluke play and now people are are analyzing 3 years worth of games to point the finger at #9. If that pass would have hit the ground or been tipped a few inches awry and out of the in-stride grasp of a lucky half-ass WR, the Bengals would have won that game with a formidable defense and clutch late game heroics by Carson and the offense. Now it’s handwringing time? My suggestion for worriers? Relax. My half-ass suggestion for the O? Open things up. Use all our weapons,e.g., (1)use Coffman for his pass-catching ability,which is phenomenal;(2)throw the ball to Henry;(3)get the ball into the hands of B. Scott, Leonard and Dorsey.

by virginiastripes on Sep 14, 2009 3:27 PM EDT reply actions   1 recs

This felt like preseason

If there is no fluke reception and the Bengals win this game, we’d be talking about how this game was 3/4 preseason where Palmer was working out the kinks, shaking off the rust, and trying to establish timing with his receivers and 1/4 regular season where Palmer showed he is mentally and physically ready with that final touchdown drive. He’d be credited with only 1 interception because he wouldn’t have had to toss up that last second hail mary and we’d be saying how he might have had a 300-yard passing game if they had cut the dropped passes in half.

by LooseCannon on Sep 14, 2009 3:30 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Palmer is fine

He needs better coaching, playcalling, and a better line.
I bet he hears defensive footsteps in his sleep….
Who could blame him for happy feet.

by Sloppygolf on Sep 14, 2009 4:08 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

CP

Not the problem. Dropped passes not going to be the problem-Caldwell should be number 2 and Coles should get the slot-assuming he will stop the dropsies. O-line big problem-they had their moments but inconsistent-esp. Collins. Play calling and adaping to blitz-huge problem. If they can play agressively-hey no huddle?- some of the time, the line will block better and Carson will come through like his last drive. The
offense has to dictate to the defense not the other way!

by featherman on Sep 14, 2009 4:15 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Red Zone

Did Denver have an snaps in the Red Zone? I don’t think that they did. That is notable.

by R.F. Mehl on Sep 14, 2009 4:34 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Starts at the top...

When you come to Cincinnati, you’re not going to be surrounded by the best talent or coaching staff, thanks to MB. So could Carson be elite with a legitimate franchise? Absolutely. But at this point, his spirit has to be zapped, like most guys who stick around here too long. I think the guy has too much pride to pull an Archie Manning. He’s going to want out eventually.

by bodacio on Sep 14, 2009 5:28 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Carson Palmer

I think two things are at the front of the crummy offense #1 the offensive line has not been the same since ‘05 and may never be that good again, however, I think it is getting better #2 I think the play calling stinks at times, Coach B. has been here for ever and I think he is getting stale on his play calling. Carson Palmer is still a good QB, not in Brady, Breese or Payton company anymore, but still good when healthy! He’s still a top 10 QB.

by Texas Bengal on Sep 14, 2009 5:56 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

“getting” stale?

I wouldn’t recommend anybody even try to smell (much less eat) some food you think is “not quite spoiled yet”…

by FriarBob on Sep 14, 2009 8:02 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

We need to protect our investment

If we want Carson Palmer to return to elite status we need to give him absolute
protection..why do u think linemen are being paid so much.. We’ve got the pistol but mike brown forgot the bullets..meaning in order to be effective elite qb u absolutely need an o line

by ak513 on Sep 14, 2009 6:10 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Yup. It doesn’t have to be perfect, but it needs to be decent and it needs to be in sync, both among themselves and with the QB.

For a case in point, look at the highlight reel of the Lions vs. the Saints yesterday. Brees throws dozens of great passes from collapsing pockets where his OL kept his opposition just barely far enough away… but he runs up the pocket several times, side steps a few more, scrambles even a few more… yet he hung up 6 TDs and could have more… sometimes even against 8-man coverage looks. Just look at his second TD to Shockey for an example on that one. The Lions only rushed three, still flushed him from the pocket, and then he tosses a lightning rod right to his guy.

That’s not really a great OL there. They’re decent, but not great. That’s elite QB play… mostly. But it’s also a style fit. Brees knows that A) they know how to work together, and B) he knows their tendencies AND C) he’s mobile enough to adjust for their failures.

Right now, Carson is none of the above. SOME of that is just rust, though. I hope most of it is. But part of it is that Brat is so far past his expiration date that he’s soon going to need his own geologic period. Unless he grows a brain, and FAST, it’s going to be a long year.

by FriarBob on Sep 14, 2009 8:12 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Bengals should have put more points on the board. The game did not have to come down to that fluky deflection. You need to score when you get down inside the red zone. Bengals’ ED – Execution dysfunction (# of times you fail to score TDs when you are inside that red zone) needs to be corrected. It does not matter who does the fixing, whether it is Lewis, Bratkowski, Palmer, the entire OL, or Benson’s RB crew. Guys, when you smell that line, you better be hungry.

by Richard L on Sep 14, 2009 8:27 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

The Offence

Brat doesnt call a game consistent with Carsons ability.Get a new and competent OC in there to lead Carson, and wins will come, And kill Mike Brown and everyone related to him, when Paul died so did this franchise!!!

by B-Minus on Sep 14, 2009 8:39 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

given the opportunity to open it up with the no-huddle, carson led the team on a 91-yard drive that ended with a touchdown.

prior to that, the best offensive playcall came on a fake punt, called by darrin simmons.

that tells you all you need to know.

by Raging Clue on Sep 14, 2009 10:02 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

No huddle

in 05 and 06 the bungles ran the no huddle. that made them a high power offense.the only time they ran the no huddle is when they had to at the end of the game. it seems that back then they were very successful at it. they still are. they marched down field and scored. i know you can manage the clock somewhat with the no huddle. it seems to me that this is what this offense is good at. so why not use it again. in 07 & 08 they didn’t use it either. carson is better suited for the no huddle along with chad ocho. this is what this offense needs for carson to be successful. OR IS THIS MB MAKING THE CALLS!!!!! I CALL THIS THE CURSE OF MIKE BROWN.

by WHYUS!! on Sep 14, 2009 10:48 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Definitely not Carson’s fault, but I may be a little bit biased. Too many dropped passes that stalled and stopped drives. And can I mention a botched field goal attempt and another tipped passed that was intercepted? Carson played fine, I’m not panicking about him. It’s everybody else on the offense who needs to step up in a big way.

This is our year!

by Carsonorbust on Sep 14, 2009 11:04 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Who Dey should be throwing the ball around...

Like the 2000 Rams. There’s this much talent in the skill positions, save the Marshall Faulk quotient — no offense to Cedric Benson either.

by IFChris on Sep 14, 2009 11:15 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

IMHO I agree it is not the QB’s fault. He will, of course, get the blame for incomplete/intercepted passes, but football IS a team effort and if just one guy goofs up, the whole team ends up as losers.
Sometimes its a matter of luck (see the last play by the broncos) of being in the right place at the right time. And some teams are luckier than others – it is not ability as most players in the NFL ARE good, and you can see that stuff like Tyne’s catch in the previous superbowl and Steelers winning (Steelers suck BTW!).
And a lot of times the zebras have blinkers on their eyes……
The team has had a lot of distractions these past few years and the guys have to focus and get their priorities straight now – it is ALL about winning and whether you win by big scores or little ones, that’s all that matters. The bengals are meowing pussycats right now and need to become roaring tigers fast.

by dHb on Sep 15, 2009 1:36 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

offensive cordinator needs to go

and the owner needs to fix the frigging o-line.

by palewook on Sep 15, 2009 6:24 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Palmer is the man!

He’s the class of the organization. He’s Whodey Nations rock! And we’re clinging to him for dear life. If you’ll allow me….I think morphing his name into the Marine Rifleman’s Creed says it best:

This is my Palmer,
There are many like him, but Palmer is mine!

Without our Palmer we are useless…………

And I can’t say the rest or it would implie that without us he is useless and that’s just not the case.

Look at the issues:
You have Ocho Stinko that is supposedly our " #1 wide receiver"…..yet show me how many times when we’ve been down in a game (because we lacked the defense to stop teams) and we’ve needed Ocho to come thru, how many times has that really happened??
I can tell you I was at the Cardinals game in Cincy 2007 and watched as we were 3rd and 17, late in the fourth quarter putting a drive together to tie up or go ahead in the game….and Ocho caught it at 14 yds and walked backwards out of bounds. Simply put, when the game is on the line, if he’s even slightly rattled, his head is not in the game and he’s cost us a few, along with pissing off opposing teams.

Look at our running back situations:
Rudi was like a wind up Helen Keller doll…you wind him up, he would run for a yard and fall down. No threat here!
Chris Perry, here’s another fine example. Supposed to be a stud out of the backfield with his hands and his feet of gold…….and what did he produce for us in 5 seasons…not squat.

Then you look at Chris Henry and the windfall of arrests that plagued our team after the 05’ season. Suspensions and therefore lack of personnel due to their conduct, not his….and we lost a lot of good talent to BS!

Palmer has been the foundation, the rock of this organization since he got here. He is the man with the ability to lead us to the promise land, if the talent around him stands up and plays to their potential.

And let me speak on that for a second. You can also attribute his lack of ability to get to the playoffs because Brown has his nose in the locker room way too much, and wouldn’t give Lewis the personnel he asked for. Because Brown is a cheapskate! Plain and simple. He’s part of the cancer rotting the Bengals organization to it’s core. Andre Smith is another prime example of that. What he was asking for, and what Brown was willing to give had a margin of 1.5 mill……………..Question: If you think he’s valuable enough to take as the overall 1st round draft pick, then why in hell don’t you get it in gear and have him signed ASAP. All this bull of waiting until the last minute to sign people is garbage. And Palmer has been the only exception in recent years that was signed that way. Brown is too worried about money, to actually attempt to keep players in Cincy happy and being productive. And that has inevitably hurt Carson’s chances to get to the playoffs.

If Palmer doesn’t go down on the opening play of the wildcard playoff in Cincy 05’…..we win that Superbowl, I believe. It’s not his fault and he’s our shining light in Cincy!

In CARSON we trust!!!!!!

by Whodey4life88 on Sep 15, 2009 8:11 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

get off the pole

you are way up on carsons pole. carson is great and you got it right about MB. carson will never be as good as he was with an o-line like this. these guys are ok but 2nd rated lineman. hope they get better but with MB running things dont see it happening. smith is a bust, hope not but he was picked by MB. just like the other smith that he picked in the first rd.

by WHYUS!! on Sep 15, 2009 8:42 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Up on Carson's pole?

This was a question about him. If you asked me about another Bengal, I’d say what I had to say about them too.

The reality is, when push comes to shove Carson is the face of the Bengals. He’s all class. When they lose, he’s the one taking responsibility even if he wasn’t really the problem. And he’s a class act in the Cincy community and NO ARRESTS.

So I’m a big fan, cause I have two sons who are Bengals fans, and he immulates what I want my son worshiping when it comes to pro athletes. And yes Mike Brown is a cancer.

I honestly just hate to see a guy with his class and his talent that is constantly held back by the bs of the POS’s he’s surrounded by that don’t pull their weight. He’s been held back and held down by the garbage of other’s actions in the offseason and during, on and off the field.

I would think it would be a shame that such a football god would go down in history with Marino as never having had a Superbowl win, because the Bengals can’t get it together. And I especially hate the thought of losing him to another team when the time comes at the end of his contract and they haven’t broken the stigma in Cincy and actually put a winning team on the field around him to get us to the promise land.

by Whodey4life88 on Sep 15, 2009 9:21 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Preseason Injury Factor

I don’t think it’s Carson’s fault, but he didn’t get the time preseason like he needed to be in sync with his recievers.

I also believe that the line needed to be under fire for this game in order to solidify, which I think it did by the 4th quarter.

by UpStateMike on Sep 15, 2009 9:38 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

I never saw Palmer out of sync.

He threw 3 bad passes during the game (the pick, the bad pump fake pass which was almost picked and the pass behind Caldwell on 3rd down. The rest of the time he was crisp and right on the money, but the receivers let him down.

by St. Esiason on Sep 16, 2009 12:01 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I see better than I hear too Marvin

Brat – get aggressive or get out. Stop using the Oline as an excuse and play to our strengths. Pittsburg’s Oline isn’t very good and they win the SB. Do your job or quit so we can move on. You are not pulling your weight.

I am getting tired of hearing how good Carson is. – Show me.

Marvin – all of this is his responsibility. Much of our problem has to do with unforced errors. Wrong routes, dead ball penalties, people out of position, illegal guy down field and the like. That is a result of poor teaching and bad discipline. That is Marvin’s fault and it is his responsibility. He is always blaming the players. MB needs to tighten up Marvin’s wig. We have much better talent on the O than we are seeing. No way we should go 55 minutes without scoring against anybody let alone a mediocre D like Denver. I would tell him the same thing he told the players after a loss on Hard Knocks. FIX IT!! Fix it or quit, take Brat with you and let us get someone who will. Period!! At least half of our problems are on you not MB.

" My enemy said "Love your enemy". I obeyed and loved myself." Gibran

by JUNGLEJOHN on Sep 15, 2009 9:48 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

wrong

the only constant since the Bengals have become perennial losers is MIKEY.

by featherman on Sep 15, 2009 8:00 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

who hired marvin? what his his name? who has final say? who sticks his nose in where it dont belong? does all of this disrupts the team? do the players see this?do all of these answers give the players a different massage? marvin isnt perfect, neither is carson. like i said carson is not god. but when somebody like MB does what he does you are not going anywhere! I feel for the players that have talent. they are stuck with the bengals just like us. I can only hope things can change. starting with MB. we have a curse THE CURSE OF MIKE BROWN!!!!!! GOD HELP US

by WHYUS!! on Sep 15, 2009 11:49 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Easy Target

MB is an easy target and he makes himself one but our raw talent is better than our record. A good coach makes average players above average. Look at what Zimmer did with what we had in one year – with a slew of injuries replacement players off the street. I am not an apologist for MB. I don’t like him either but as far as I can see MB’s influence pretty well ends at the locker room door. I just don’t think the players have respect for ML and it shows in the lack of fundamentals. ML knows nobody likes MB and he hides behind the axiom " MB calls the shots not me". MB may not get us the best talent at all positions but the big problem is that ML is not getting all he can form what he has. He has stuck behind Brat way too long. There is more to being a coach than slogans and screaming.

" My enemy said "Love your enemy". I obeyed and loved myself." Gibran

by JUNGLEJOHN on Sep 16, 2009 8:42 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

see hard knocks!!!!!

MB is a easy target because hes a friggin idiot when it comes to football. hes the one that puts this team together, makes decisions and expects everyone to do exactly what he says. he owns the team and thinks he knows football. MB hides behind the coaches (see all coaches that were here). you mean to tell me that out of all of the coaches that were here, that they were the problem each time. who hired them. we got the full effect of how things were ran on hard knocks. nobody is aloud to stand up to MB. (see Chris Henry). all of the coaches that were here or are here, are the problem. I don’t think so!!! MB GO JUMP OFF A FRIGGIN BRIDGE!!!!!!!

by WHYUS!! on Sep 17, 2009 7:55 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

It is his team and our choice

MB has every right to run the team the way he sees fit. It is his team. You have a right not to like it and complain about it. I’m no fan of his. If he worked for me he would not have had a chance to out up a big losing streak. I would have let him go after a couple of years.

If we were playing to our talent level I would put it all on him but we have enough talent here to be very competitive if ML and his crew were getting the best out of them. We did not lose to Denver because of MB. We lost because ML did not have the team properly prepared – period. Way too many players committed way too many unforced errors. Coles has a history of being a very good WR. He just didn’t have his head in the game. MB does not put the game plan together, call the plays or motivate players. That is Marvin’s job and he is not getting it done and he hasn’t for years. Marvn needs to “do your job”, “keep shoveling” and sacrifice. He needs to “Fix it”. It is not all MB’s fault – in fact little of it is.

" My enemy said "Love your enemy". I obeyed and loved myself." Gibran

by JUNGLEJOHN on Sep 17, 2009 8:50 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

its my opinion

that MB has his hand in the cookie jar. (presence in the locker room) his philosophical BS is contagious!!!! I’ve played ball before (not at professional level) and things can mentally screw you up, especially as a team. there is a repeat pattern here. Don’t you see that. Marvin’s hands are tied. Here in cinci you go with the flow or you get fired!!!! Be a part of MIKEYS TEAM. WE ARE ALL FAMILY HERE!!!!! All Marvin is doing is holding on until his contract is up. I bet you he becomes a head coach else where and is successful. MARK MY WORDS. WE WILL HAVE THIS CONVERSATION AGAIN WHEN THAT TIME COMES!!!!!! and further more i have the right to bitch because my tax dollars are paying for that stadium he wanted, that he was supposed to put a competitive team in.

by WHYUS!! on Sep 17, 2009 10:15 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Comments For This Post Are Closed


User Tools

Welcome to the SB Nation blog about the Cincinnati Bengals.
Start posting about the Bengals »

Join SB Nation and dive into communities focused on all your favorite teams.

FanPosts

Community blog posts and discussion.

Recent FanPosts

Tiger_joe_small
Prospect Watch: Demaryius Thomas
Small
Bengal 2010 Draft
Small
What Might Ruin the NFL Next Year
Palmer_small
Pointless debate of the week
Tiger_joe_small
Prospect Watch: Brandon Graham
Tiger_joe_small
Andre Caldwell vs Rookie WR
Tiger_joe_small
Bengals and Senior Bowl
C1fc33125ca7_small
Bengals Mock Draft
Helmet_small
Ocho Cinco our new kicker? seriously
Helmet_small
Maualuga arrested!!!! Man 2010 starting off bad!!!

+ New FanPost All FanPosts >

Latest NFL Headlines from SB Nation

Acme Packing Company
Replay: Tracy Porter's Super Bowl INT Return
Mocking The Draft
Morgan Burnett NFL Draft scouting report
The Phinsider
A quick look at free agent tight ends

Managers

Atari_small Kirkendall

Twitter_profile_pic_small A Pragmatic Bengals Fan

Authors

Small Vman in Germany

Oso-bengalslogo-animation_small Jay McDonnell

Henry152_small IFChris

Huber090426_440_small jsl413

Infighting_small Mojokong