Open Thread: Observations about the Bengals heading into the offseason
by Josh Kirkendall on Jan 10, 2010 5:33 PM EST
in Analysis
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PrintThrough the first quarter in the second NFC Wild Card game, the Arizona Cardinals are dominating the Green Bay Packers. This came after the Baltimore Ravens dominated the New England Patriots and the Dallas Cowboys dominated the Philadelphia Eagles. Domination. Though it wasn't so much domination in the Bengals one-and-done game against the New York Jets, the end result left all of us empty. Perhaps it should have been expected considering the way Cincinnati lost their steam and mojo towards the end of the season. Regardless, the season is over.
I'm not sure if the problem with the team's passing game this year is the quarterback, or the talent around him. Either way, this team needs to focus on getting the passing game off the ground again. That leads me into a couple of beliefs that needs to be addressed this offseason.
- First and foremost, Jerome Simpson has to man up. The Bengals took a risk on Simpson in the second round of the 2008 NFL draft. Now it's his turn to prove that the Bengals made the right decision or else take a different direction.
- However, since I said that last year and since he could have proven something this year, I believe the Bengals need to address wide receivers in the offseason no matter what. They should address the position again in the NFL draft, sign guys on free agency, let Laveranues Coles go and promote Quan Cosby.
- Early in the season, Andre Caldwell seemed like the answer to the team's short passing game. In the second half of the season, if Caldwell wasn't making mistakes, he turned ineffectual.
Considering that wide receivers are hardly the only pressing matter with this team, here's a few more observations.
- The Bengals shouldn't attempt to re-sign Shayne Graham. He's been a quality field goal kicker throughout the early Marvin Lewis era. However, you need a kicker that can convert field goals in the redzone during a playoff game. If he can't do that, then what good is he?
- I think the Bengals offensive line was one of the reasons they went from 4-11-1 to 10-6 and a playoff berth. On the other hand, they need to improve pass protection schemes and the Bengals need other players that can block -- hence we miss Reggie Kelly and Kenny Watson's ability to block at their respective positions.
- I believe that Cincinnati should go after an impact safety on the first day of the NFL draft.
- J.P. Foschi would be a decent backup tight end. But considering that Chase Coffman struggled to be an active tight end during game day, the Bengals might want to search other avenues.
- Perhaps Carson Palmer needs competition at quarterback and the Bengals need a good quarterback to back him up. Draft someone.
What improvements with the team's players and positions do you guys think need to be made?
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Cutting Coles will free up money.
Coffman could be another Todd Heap if he is developed right, hopefully he will gain some weight & learn the blocking schemes.
by Vman in Germany on Jan 10, 2010 5:45 PM EST reply actions
Off Season Needs
DEFENSE
- First, we MUST retain Mike Zimmer.
- Second, we need a sure-fire Safety and that should be priority number 1 in the draft. Our first round pick must go to a safety.
- Third, we need to re-sign some of our players….Tank, Roy, etc…
- Overall, our defense is solid, but another year under Zimmer’s system and with a clean bill of health (Odom, Rey, etc..)….our defense is easily top 5 once again
OFFENSE
- First, we need a new Offensive Coordinator
- We need a vertical WR badly…..Ocho can go deep, but he is always going to be covered by the opposing teams best Corner. We are not going to get Marshall or Boldin (would love if I was proved wrong) because they simply are going to cost too much. Someone like Breaston, Vincent Jackson, etc…would be much better. The Simpson experiment appears to be a complete failure and we can not afford to attempt to develop another WR via the draft because we are on the cusp of becoming a SB contender.
- TE…COATS needs to go. We can retain Foschi and retain Kelley, but I still don’t think they are good enough. We need some help them there…..Coffman? I don’t know.
- Guard….we need a badass Guard to secure this line…..I hope we can address this via the draft.
LASTLY,
We need Mike Brown to get his head out of his ass. Elite clubs do not become elite without the help of a great owner. I know Brown has a bad reputation, but I truly hope this season and this taste of small success has changed his idea on spending a bit.
Look at Bidwell from the Arizona Cardinals last year. He had a bad reputation of not spending money and finally got some success with the Cardinals last year. He finally opened up the check book and paid Warner and some other players as well. Now, the Cardinals are advancing into the 2nd round and look strong.
GO BENGALS!
by SanAntonioTX_Bengal on Jan 10, 2010 5:54 PM EST reply actions
Off-Season for Bengals
Priorities (no particular order):
- Re-sign Mike Zimmer, DC
- Release L. Coles. Inexcusable to be paid that much to do so little.
- Do not re-sign Shayne Graham. Any K that can’t make chipshots from the Red Zone in a playoff game is not meant to be employed.
- Fire Bob Bratkowski and hire a new OC. It’s a longshot … but thought I would mention it. If fans watching the game can predict what is coming each down, don’t you think paid professionals on the other sideline who scout opponent’s would know? Unimaginative play-calling.
- Draft S, speed receiver & young QB (maybe McCoy, Pike … Tebow is overrated) I would almost say that the speed receiver is our 1st rounder, with the loss of Henry and the others not able to stretch the field, it is almost the most important aspect to correct.
- Release Jerome Simpson. Simpson is a bust, and it’s time to acknowledge that. Sad that we could have had DeSean Jackson (WR), Ray Rice (RB) or M. Bennet (TE), but they wasted it on an unknown from a small school … which in turn brings us to …
- Increasing the scouting department. Yes, they did pretty good last year (lucky Rey fell to second round), but let’s be honest, it was lucky last year. Look at previous drafts to see how “successful” they have been. And, I don’t want to hear about D. Jackson having “character issues”, they did draft Andre Smith last year and he had some “issues” as well.
- Re-sign some of our depth (Tank, Roy W., etc.)
- Release Dan Coats. Please … he can’t catch … he’s the Heyward-Bey of TEs, except he’s also not fast for a TE.
- Sorry to say, but Palmer looks like a shadow of his former self, which is sad. Going into the season healthy I thought he could return to his top 5 QB form, but he looked terrible in some games. Yes, he led some comebacks, but was wildly inconsistent. It’s not always his fault, line protection being what it is and the OC, but still, high throws, miscommunications, bad throws, bad decisions and easy to read audibles are all his calls. I think we need to start looking at a new QB, maybe not this year, but soon, like 2-3 years. He also doesn’t seem to have the fire other QBs have. As I watch this AZ-GB game, I see Warner coming off the sidelines yelling at his WR about a route or something, getting on his players. I never see Palmer doing something like that. As a franchise QB, you need to be the leader on that team. Sorry, I don’t believe in quiet leadership.
- Mike Brown needs to sell the team to a new owner … I know, never happen, but I will always put this on the list.
My last one is why this team seems to “play down” to the level of competition? I cannot pinpoint it on any one thing, but they go in and play tough against Baltimore, Pitt, etc., then go into Oakland and look terrible … barely beat Cle and KC. It’s another thing they need to fix. Not sure if it’s Lewis or what, but I just don’t see the fire from Marvin either. I think they need a coach that will ignite this team, maybe Lewis is not the guy.
I agreee with most of your points..
But I don’t understand where people are coming from when they say we should draft Tony Pike. The guy clearly showed in the Sugar Bowl that he has zero pocket presence and no moxy against NFL caliber athletes. No way do I want him on this team. In fact, I’d rather have the kid from Central Michigan, Dan LeFevour, as a project than Pike. I know he’s never run a “pro-style” offense but he’s intelligent, has good awareness, and he WINS. Let someone else take a chance on Pike.
Tony Pike
Pike gets overhyped on this board because he is a UC Bearcat. I cant see him being drafted higher than the fifth round. I love LeFevour. I wouldnt mind seeing us draft him in like round 3 or 4.
My three favorite things in the world in no particular order: My wife, sex with my wife, and The Cincinnati Bengals
true, you both might be right, i also just don’t think the bengals will draft a QB in the early rounds as clearly they have more pressing needs. Pike was overmatched in the Sugar Bowl, but you never know. Speed receiver and playmaker at S are the most pressing needs. MB stepping down the most important to any Bengals fan … haha!
Any real organization...
…would already have released Graham and Bratkowski. You got a kicker who has cost you the playoffs in 2006, and possibly a chance at a win this year. Then you have a coordinator who finished dead last in offense last year, and I believe 22nd this year. 20 points per game. Any organization that wanted to progess and not just make money, would let these 2 clowns go. You have enough weapons on offense (Carson, Benson, Chad) But no creativity. To the guy on the last post, saying he wouldn’t pile on Brat because Benson had 169 yards and Palmer was overthowing guys, I must say this: in the game I watched, Benson was running into a wall of defenders when he went in the direction of the play call. He made most of his yards by cutting back and running away from the o-line. As for Palmer, its a mechanics problem, (which he should be coached through) combined with a very unimaginative playbook (no wildcat, no quick slants etc).
Not to mention they are terrible at picking up the blitz. We need someone fresh and modern at OC, maybe bring in Norm Chow as QB coach to work on Carson’s mechanics (he is familiar w/ Palmer) and it would be nice to see Zimmer retained and the Franchise let go. Of course, none of these things will happen with MB at the helm.
P.S. Where was Foschi yesterday? Coats dropped another one.
off season
evryone here has pretty much summed up the needs for the off season. The big one in my opinion is getting Zimmer a contract that will keep him here before its too late.
There are a few free agents they should get re-signed and a couple they should let go in my opinion.
Re-sign — Bobbie Williams, Tank Johnson, Roy Williams, Brandon Johnson, Frostee Rucker, Rashad Jeanty
Let go — Shayne Graham (should have tagged TJ with franchise last year), Daniel Coates, Jeremi Johnson, Jordan Palmer
Lets hope they pick up a quality receiver to compliment Ocho and also get some good players in the draft this year!!
Bratkowski should go but probably won’t.
A few thoughts... O Line, O Line, O Line.
I think the first thing we should do, after resigning some of the vets that gave us some swag on D, is address the Offensive Line. Those guys aren’t bad, but we need to add a few pass protection guys. Whit is a Pro Bowl Guard, lets get him there. Smith needs to be focused on and make sure we get some of his talent to come to on field results. I like Bobbie Williams, but he is getting older. I never focused on Cook but I hope he keeps improving, but if he isn’t the answer at C, lets look at Luigs.
The reason I’m big on addressing the OLine, is I feel Carson is still a top 10 QB and someone who can lead us to a deep playoff run year in and year out. However, we must protect him.
Hey I am all for Zimmer and I really want him back but if he is not, it isnt the end of the world. Don’t break the bank on him.
How about a one year cheapie deal for TO? I know he is over the hill but he still has some left in the tank.
O-Line
The O-line clearly took a step forward this year, but it still needs work. If Bobbie Williams’ contract is up, I say, let him go. He got beat on an inside rush at the end of the game, and I think his pass blocking has been lacking all season.
I doubt the Bengals will do this , but if we went with
LT-COLLINS
LG-Mathis/Livings
C-Cook
RG-SMITH
RT-WHITWORTH
the pass blocking immediately takes a big step up.
The running blocking drops a little with Collins, but Andre is a beast, and with adequate tackle quickness, we would be an elite RG, and Whitworth, going against more power guys on the right side could be a pro-bowler.
Agreed
I am not much of a fan on Carson’s blind side there, however. Collins hasn’t show much this past season other than a viable back up. We need another Tackle and I also think Whit is a stud guard and Smith could be a very good RT.
Collins is misplaced at RT
the guy blanked Harrison at LT. He is naturally a pass-blocker and finesse guy. He looked like a healthy Levi Jones at LT. I think he lesser run-blocking skills has kept him in the doghouse
by Sheffieldbengal on Jan 10, 2010 7:37 PM EST up reply actions
makes sense.
I’d like to see more out of him.
I forgot about Shirley, I would love to see his huge frame work out as our 2012 starting RG. He is also nasty and as a mean streak.
I think more time could really help develop them, but what would develop them to possibly another level, like the ‘05 level, would be the addition of another tackle. I know WillieAnderson’s and LeviJones’ don’t grow on trees, but finding someone who can protect Carson;s blind side, moving Whit to Guard would go a long way.
Whitworth
is a fit at RT but i think the Bengal’s won’t change the line around. They like what they have but feel that the line just needs more time together (it was how the Giants went from run-blocking line to superbowl winners)
by Sheffieldbengal on Jan 10, 2010 7:35 PM EST up reply actions
continuity may be the key, and they could play better with the same people next year.
Also, Mathis could play LG, and Livings RG.
Mathis is that 300lb pulling type Faneca LG, and Livings is big, and could play the power RG
John Thornton
our ex DT said Livings was the nastiest hardest G he has ever faced so him playing at RG may be the right spot for him.
by Sheffieldbengal on Jan 10, 2010 7:40 PM EST up reply actions
Roland wasn’t playing that bad at the end of the year. Where does he fit in with your new OL.
by Greener's eyes on Jan 10, 2010 11:00 PM EST up reply actions
Cook is the answer
one thing to keep in mind is that our O-line has the second least starts of any line in the NFL (Buff has the least). So this group can get better. Whitworth has done really well at LT. All i would do is get Smith in at RT full time and use Roland as a blocking TE.
Bobbie is out of contract but we’ll give him another year. His back-up may be Jason Shirely (yeah that DT we drafted) as he pancaked a few guys in preseason. If we draft a G in the late rounds it will be a signal he isn’t the future.
by Sheffieldbengal on Jan 10, 2010 7:34 PM EST up reply actions
I was just looking at the 2010 WR free agents. Here is the list of notables. Anybody you guys see here that the Bengals can afford and would be worth the price??
Brandon Marshall
Vincent Jackson
TO
Miles Austin
Braylon Edwards
Antonio Bryant
Steve Breaston — restricted FA
Malcom Floyd
Kevin Walter
Jason Avant
Davone Bess – Exclusive Rights FA
Mark Bradley
Isaac Bruce
Chris Chambers
Mark Clayton
David Clowney
Ronald Curry
Domenik Hixon
Lance Moore
Muhsin Muhammad
Josh Reed
Brad Smith
Bobby Wade
Kelley Washington
Demetrius Williams
Troy Williamson
Jerheme Urban
Braylon Edwards...
haha joke!… that said i bet Brown will look at him if he is cheap
by Sheffieldbengal on Jan 10, 2010 7:31 PM EST up reply actions
I'd give Mike Browns left nut
for Brandon Marshall, screw his attitude and nonsense, let Marv figure it our.
to be honest
Marshall is the type of WR Brown likes. Big, talented and with a troubled past. I think lots of teams might be put off by his “character” issues… something that Brown has never cared about
by Sheffieldbengal on Jan 10, 2010 7:44 PM EST up reply actions
There ain't much I like about him
but 1 MB is amazingly loyal and 2 he will give people a few chances if they show a penchant to reach out for help.
I think Marshall would be great but chances are prolly slim and none. Also whats up with the cap this year? is everyone restricted or something?
Mike Brown
would be a great boss or friend because he is so loyal… but as a GM in pro Sports… man that doesn’t make a winning team
by Sheffieldbengal on Jan 10, 2010 7:52 PM EST up reply actions
True
but I can help admire the quality and say I’d rather him own us, than Al Davis, but that isn’t saying much.
I always say
at least i’m not a Lions’ fan.
by Sheffieldbengal on Jan 10, 2010 8:00 PM EST up reply actions
having a roommate that is a raiders fan, we go back and forth about which team has the worst owner, but i think it’s really too close to call, but there is one major difference that i can see, at least al davis is willing to spend the money, sure it’s wasted on lame players like russell and heyward-bey, but at least he will open the wallet.
Thinks I think
As others have said, get Zimmer signed. Other rambling thoughts:
1) Need a playmaker safety
2) Is it just me or is Keith Rivers a mediocre linebacker that has little big play ability? Brandon Johnson seems a better talent.
3) Cosby is a steal, is he the Bengal rookie of the year? Can he be a #3 reciever if we get a downfield threat.
4) Is Andre Smith going to be solid or are we going to regret not taking Crabtree?
5) Tight end is a nightmare. Foshi is a good backup.
6) Carson, there are 15 QB’s I would take over him
Keith Rivers
is so good at WLB. Seriously he allows Dhani to blitz and not be shown up in coverage. The thing with WLBs in Zimmer’s schemes is that they are just like another CB. Think about it this way… if you don’t notice Rivers… he’s doing his job.
Plus against Detriot he made a massive run stop to get us back the ball and allow us to keep our momentum. Against KC he stopped a pass and stuffed a run to stop their drive and force them back to punt. Aginst the Chargers he got that INT to bring us back into the game. The guy is such a good LB. Can he get better? yes. But seriously… the guy does hus job and he is getting better every week.
The first game against the Jets he didn’t do that well… the second game he was good in coverage but in both games the loss of Mauluaga was so evident as our no.1 run stuffer was gone. That (run-stuffing) is not Rivers’ no. 1 job.
The guy was on IR last year so in some ways he is still a rookie. The guy is really solid at WLB and is getting better….
Can people lay off him… he does his job to a great extent.
by Sheffieldbengal on Jan 10, 2010 7:29 PM EST up reply actions
I agree about Rivers
I felt like he made Dhani look good this year.
Once Rey and Rivers get a full NFL offseason under their belt together, and get healthy, we will be tough. Also with Odom coming back, it’ll be pretty damn difficult to even focus on those two.
How good were Zimmer;s schemes that we still got tons of pressure on the QB even without our best passrusher. Also our CB caused many coverage sacks.
as i have said elsewhere
i have a sneaking feeling that the Bengals will draft Taylor Mays thinking he is a Roy Williams with 4.3 speed. The guy hasn’t really gotten pass-coverage as well as he should with his physical ability but i think Brown will fall in love with him.
Plus if Zimmer stays i think he’d love a chance on making Mays the next Troy Polumalu.
by Sheffieldbengal on Jan 10, 2010 7:46 PM EST up reply actions
Mays has great talent
But, watching him many times, he always seemed fragile to me, even though he played a lot of games and stayed pretty healthy. I don;t know, he seems to play football kind of gingerly at times, almost timid, and it probably has something to do with him not understanding pass-coverage.
Saftey is interesting
Teams with excellent, Healthy safeties go deep in the playoffs, but the get hurt all the time. Polamolu, Reed, Bob Sanders. R. Williams all missed a lot of games this year
haha maybe you did expect too much. I think that is why his draft stock is low. The guy has all the tools but like QBs who go back to school its hard not to over-analyse his play.
And one thing you do bring up is his outstanding run of health at a position hard to keep healthy.
One bonus with Mays is that if he bombs at S he can always be a LB
by Sheffieldbengal on Jan 10, 2010 7:58 PM EST up reply actions
Mays knock
Is his coverage skills and angles. But I think you can teach that especially with his skills.
RIP Slim.
by brandone on Jan 11, 2010 5:58 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
i didn’t see hard knocks, so i may have missed it, but i always thought lynch was solid when he played and thought it given the playing time he could get better. not sure how nelson beat him out, but nelson looked horrible in both games against the jets. lynch meanwhile, was picked up by tampa bay. he’s obviously not the answer at S, but seemed better than Nelson.
Lynch
was timid when hitting his preseason. Not getting injured was on his mind and Nelson was throwing himself around and got an INT.
Neither were going to be the standard one expects from a solid backup or starting S. The injury to Roy really hurt us down the stretch.
by Sheffieldbengal on Jan 11, 2010 8:16 AM EST up reply actions
Other Needs
2nd Wr (Caldwell and Cosby are good in the slot, but we need some else)
Nickel Corner (maybe Trent will be better)
Free Safety-(Williams and Ndukwe are solid SS, but if Mays is around and a potential Pro-Bowler, I guess we have to take him)
I like Trent
Am I alone here? He has his flaws and got exposed more and more as the seaosn progressed but I still like him.
nah i like Trent
but certain types of WRs he isn’t as good against…. he also suffered in some games because he got left on an Island… and as a rookie that is hard to do.
We need a smaller faster nickle to help aid depth (but Brown hates taking CBs under 6’)
by Sheffieldbengal on Jan 10, 2010 7:54 PM EST up reply actions
Caldwell's
slide from Mr. Clutch to Mr. Mistake happend after Henry got injured. We need another big-bodied WR to get attention away from his as he is pretty good over the middle against an over-aggressive CB (as he showed in last-second/min against Pitts and Ravens)
by Sheffieldbengal on Jan 10, 2010 7:51 PM EST up reply actions
Rackers just missed from 34
curse of choking Bengals kickers
haha
just what i though as he kicked.
by Sheffieldbengal on Jan 10, 2010 7:55 PM EST up reply actions
bad balance from the Kicker. Rackers looked really nervous.
by Sheffieldbengal on Jan 10, 2010 7:56 PM EST up reply actions
WOW!
what an end to the Cards-Packers’ game!
by Sheffieldbengal on Jan 10, 2010 8:01 PM EST reply actions
yeah Rodgers’ fumbles it… boots it into Dansby’s arms who scores a Defensive TD
by Sheffieldbengal on Jan 10, 2010 8:02 PM EST up reply actions
Rackers is wiping his brow right now. He feels he has gotten away with one.
by Sheffieldbengal on Jan 10, 2010 8:06 PM EST up reply actions
Oh wow!!
The commentator just said that this is the highest scoring post season game of all time!!
Hmm
1) Coordinators- Keep Zimmer and lose Brat no matter what the cost. Hell, it wouldn’t have been a bad idea to have taken a run at Charlie Weis as OC before KC inked him. Unless this first task is completed anything else is just cosmetic.
2)Defensive Backfield- Personally, I’m content with Ndukwe, Crocker, and, presumably, Roy Williams at safety and JonJo, Leon, and Morgan Trent at corner. Not saying we couldn’t use some depth but a first on Berry, Earl Thomas, or Taylor Mays seems inefficient.
3) Wide Receiver- Watching the Cardinals number four receiver, Doucet, coming up huge in a big game just makes me sick thinking of our situation. Chad’s not elite anymore, Coles is ineffectual, Cosby might make a good slot or 3 receiver, Caldwell maybe a fourth. We don’t just need a two. We need a legit one. There are good big receivers at Ga. Tech, Pitt, and Missouri’s- who’s names I get mixed up, not to mention Dez Bryant available in the draft but a Brandon Marshall comes ready made. Chad could probably get Marshall to behave. Yesterday really makes franchising Graham over TJ look like a brilliant decision, doesn’t it?
4) Am I the only one that thinks Whit is a disaster at LT? RT? Better. Say Whit, Andre, Cook, Bobbie, and Collins, right to left, with Mathis, Livings, and Roland in reserve- Roland functioning as blocking TE. Again, not a high draft need.
5) Linebackers- I’d really like to see Rivers, Rey, and Brandon Johnson as our starting corps, assuming Rey’s ready, with Dhani there to mentor and fill in. I wouldn’t mind a Rolando McClain, however.
6) Special Teams- Huber is solid. Graham could be replaced with a tryout at local high schools. Bernard Scott is an excellent KR, as is Cosby at PR but, assuming they both become more integral parts of the offense, I wouldn’t mind a Javier Arenas or Noel Devine.
7) Defensive Line- Assuming the trade of our entire 2010 draft slate to St. Louis to move up for Ndamukong Suh isn’t gonna happen, I’d like Terrence Cody.
8) See Number One.
by IgnatiusJReilly on Jan 10, 2010 8:12 PM EST reply actions
Can we find a college Qb to put on weight
and move to KR/WR, or maybe just sign Cribbs??
I really like Dez Bryant. I think he could become a Pro Bowler. We also need some size, so we agree there.Damaryius (SPELLING?) Thomas is the big fella from GTech, and I would like him a lot and since he entered the draft early he may slip coming from and Option school. Briscoe from Kansas could be another good WR to look at.
There is also Earl Thomas from Texas at safety who has some darn good talent. I also wasn’t big on Crocker until he was gone.
I think a healthy Peko, Tank, and Simms gives us something nice upfront on D. I;m not sweating DT as much as others.
I feel like WR and OLine would be my first two things to address. Maybe Bulaga would be there in round 1 if not a top wide out.
#3 WR
i agree with a lot of your points, but i honestly think that Chad could still be the #1 receiver here. considering that his stats were better this year since he decided that he was “stuck” in cincy. however, remember that like he said, all the players can do is go out and execute what is called, which is good ol’ Bob and his vanilla play-calling. with benson there, they did a lot more running than previous offenses and palmer coming back from knee/elbow/finger injuries, was not as sharp as he was. coles disappearing act, henry’s death, simpson’s inability to get on the field, TEs dropping passes and Caldwell/Cosby not getting into plays, defenses would put their best corner (Bailey/Revis/Asomugha/etc.) on Chad with safety help, leading to being double-teamed a lot. remember, he is still getting a lot of attention by defenses, which means he is still a threat. the loss of Henry to stretch the field hurts big, which is why a speed receiver is very important (just make sure he can catch … we don’t want another Heyward-Bey or Simpson).
More of the same
Needs
I list our top 3 needs as:
Guard, Safety and TE.
I could see taking all of the 3 in the first 3 rounds.
The one exception I would make is that I would draft Rolando McClain out of Alamaba if available in the 1st round He seems to have Dhani’s smarts and Rey’s talent, Keep Rey at SLB, keep Rivers starting weak side and leave Johnson in his current role as the nickle LB. He did great all season, but I prefer to have an extra LB who can start, I would keep Jeanty too.
Otherwise I could see Taylor Mays in the 1st if available, or Gresham TE out of Oklahoma.
Problems this year are that it looks like a weak WR class. Plus don’t expect any Free agents this year, because of the collective bargaining agreement issues.
I think that Coles and the Franchise-kicker-who-can’t need to go. I would resign Larry Johnson for a reasonable amount, say $1,000,000
I think we need a # 3 reciever that can develop into a one. I am not certain that Simpson is a bust, but he better perform this year. In all honesty I still trust Marvin overall. If he thinks that Simpson is worth keeping for next year over Purify, I will trust he is. By keeping Simpson on the roster over Purify, I assume that means he believes another team would sign him off the street. If he does not pan out, we need someone as a deep threat. I think Chad is still a number one, that Caldwell is developing nicely into a 2, and that Csby has excellent potential as a 4, but we need a consistent deep threat to keep safeties honest, and make the occasional big play.
The D line could use depth, but is OK.
This shouldn't in any way be a weak WR class.
Gilyard, Tate and Bryant come to mind immediately.
by Craig Conrad on Jan 10, 2010 8:23 PM EST up reply actions
I also think a tackle would be suitable
I like Bulaga from Iowa, and that would allow Whit/Smith to move over.
RB?
Considering the team’s commitment to the running game, I think Benson’s career will last longer if we can use him in rotation with someone else that can grind out hard yards. Leonard seems more like a TE than a true RB and Scott was barely used at RB this year (at least compared to Benson) when he was healthy. Maybe a RB in free agency or in the 4-5th round?
LJ
Larry Johnson will not be resigned.
Draft…..
1 – Safety
2 – WR
3 – TE
4 – Guard
5 – DT
6 – CB
7 – K
by SanAntonioTX_Bengal on Jan 10, 2010 9:16 PM EST reply actions
Thanks…..looking at it again….I agree with you, Adam.
If we can get Kelley back that would be nice. Foschi is a good back up, and Coffman has some potential, but won’t make an immediate impact. Nevertheless, Coats should probably go, and a TE should be taken in case we can not resign Kelley or if Coffman becomes a bust.
by SanAntonioTX_Bengal on Jan 10, 2010 9:36 PM EST up reply actions
Checked a dozen or so mocks
and they were unanimous that Jermaine Gresham would be our first pick. Trouble is A) whether he’s really fully recovered from his injury and B) whether we are or are not giving up on Chase Coffman. Because, if Reggie Kelly is back as the blocking end and Coffman is our receiving one- plus, as someone else suggested, maybe we move Brian Leonard(who’s an awful running back but a great pass catcher) to a quasi H-back, do we really need a big ticket tight end? Foschi could stick as a backup but I’d be glad to see Dan Coats go to his more natural position of, say, moving furniture.
by IgnatiusJReilly on Jan 10, 2010 9:35 PM EST reply actions
we need two good TE's
Jerry Jones didn’t give up Bennett because he knows the importance of the position…
espn says Gresham is poor blocker. We don’t need that, if there is a well rounded guy like Heath Miller, I say get him, but otherwise, the coaches need to step up and get Coffman on the field.
I think WR is the #1 priority. Williams, Crocker, Ndukwe, and mid round safety should be sufficient, unless Mays is going to be an all-pro.
Moeaki from Iowa
Seems like a complete TE.
Drafting a TE high does not mean that we are giving up on Coffman. There is a decent chance Reggie Kelly does not recover.
because of the insane deep draft
positions like TE will have players pushed into the late rounds that last year may have been mid-rounders. Moeaki should be around in the 4th or 5th (last year he would have been a 3rd).
by Sheffieldbengal on Jan 11, 2010 8:41 AM EST up reply actions
Watch this weeks mocks
We dropped a few spots in the draft this week, passing at NYJ and Baltimore. we will be picking earlier than previously mocked.
Good Lord D-Line over O-line
5 sacks by our D-Line in the last 8 games including totally being stuffed by the Raiders who were 3rd in the league in sacks and Qb hits allowed
Absolutely D-Line
If Terrence Cody is there in the first round, draft him. Plenty of quality receivers will be available in the second round. In addition to drafting a receiver in second round I would also sign a veteran free agent receiver. After watching teams like the Packers, Cardinals, Vikings and Saints for the past couple years has made me sick of watching the Bengals. Safety and Cornerback are also a need, and I assuredly agree with guys above about bringing in a QB who can pressure Palmer or eventually overtake him.
Does anyone know of a pass rusher we could pick up in the draft?
We could use another good pass rusher in case Odom goes down again. If he had played every game maybe we would still be in the playoffs
by Greener's eyes on Jan 10, 2010 11:07 PM EST reply actions
I don't know where they'll be drafted
but i like Kindle from Texas, Selvie from South Florida and Graham from Michigan. I’ll bet Michael Johnson will be a lot better next year if he adds some more muscle/weight.
Kindle has a great bowl game
he loves to hit and terrorize the QB. He’ll be long gone before our first round pick because he’ll have great combine numbers too.
Selvie disappeared and didn’t look like a solid no.1 prospect this year at all. He has one move = speed rush. And he isn’t that good against the run etc. He’ll get picked up in the mid rounds (which is quite the crash compared to last year)
Graham is good but he lacks those “triangle” numbers. He isn’t super fast, only 6’1" so he is a bit of an odditiy. He’s a second rounder if a team falls in love with his hustle and can overlook his size.
by Sheffieldbengal on Jan 11, 2010 8:23 AM EST up reply actions
I can't believe . . .
you guys think you can draft players to make an immediate impact on the team!
You would be lucky to get one starter for next year out of the draft.
A new OC and a badass free agent receiver would be the best you can hope for.
If there really is no season 2011 you’re drafting for 2012!
Why the hate for Cook?
everyone on that line respects him, he handles the NTs. He needs to get better agaisnt the 4-3 teams which require more finesse than brute strength. He’ll get better every year in charge. He also makes great line calls.
The guy blanked Kelly Gregg, Ngata and many more.
by Sheffieldbengal on Jan 11, 2010 8:25 AM EST up reply actions
How many starters or major role players did we get from last years draft?
The point is, a new WR can help Caldwell in the middle to return him to his early season form (where he wasn’t the second WR) A new DT will help rotation. A new CB can help against the smaller speed guys. A guy who can KR will allow Scott to spot Benson as a change of speed back. Or a new RB will allow Scott to concentrate on KRing full time.
To return to my question (not counting collegeFAs) we used: Rey Maualuga, Michael Johnson, Kevin Huber, Morgan Trent and Bernard Scott. That is five starters or major role players who will only get better. Count in the fact Andre Smith got snaps near the end of the year we have lots of young emerging talent for next year from this draft.
If we can get two or three contributions from rookies out of the next draft we are going to build a very solid team. (we have a very hard schedule next year so we need extra depth everywhere)
by Sheffieldbengal on Jan 11, 2010 8:33 AM EST up reply actions
My take on our needs...
Aside from the obvious need for a new OC and a new WR coach:
1. Guard. Seriously, grab the best one. After all this time, Carson is still getting killed? Really? You’d think that the injuries last year would’ve made this the #1 priority. I’m also fine with taking a true LT here and getting a guard later.
2. Wide receiver. I’d love to take a superstar in the first, but I’d rather invest in the o-line.
3. Free safety. We have safeties that can hit; let’s get one that can cover. With the AFC North becoming more pass-centric, we’ll need one.
4. SLB. I’m assuming we’re moving Rey to the inside, and while Dhani or Brandon Johnson (please resign him) can fill in here, I’d like to get a true pass-rushing SLB to develop, one that could play DE in some packages.
5. TE. Duh.
6. Kicker. Ditto.
7. DT depth. Though if we can’t keep Tank, this moves much higher.
by Big Sky Bengal on Jan 10, 2010 11:54 PM EST reply actions
To be specific...
…yeah, we drafted Andre Smith, got a new center, and moved Whit to LT, but the fact that we’re still getting the same pass-blocking results…ugh. We made keeping Carson upright a priority, but not enough of one, and we didn’t do it competently enough.
by Big Sky Bengal on Jan 10, 2010 11:59 PM EST up reply actions
some of that has to rest on Carson’s jumpy shoulders. I’ve lost count of the times he’s sacked himself because he got jumpy and couldn’t wait for a route to get open. He missed a third down against the Chargers game which led us to having to punt rather than kick a FG…
Blame also resides on the fact we have one of the youngest and greenest lines in the NFL. It is hard to build a solid line which hasn’t had time together for very long.
Other blame can reside on the musical chairs at RT. I love the unbalanced lines and utilization of an extra RT, but having a series with Roland at RT, then Collins then SMith makes it hard to find rythm and continuity.
by Sheffieldbengal on Jan 11, 2010 8:37 AM EST up reply actions
I'm more concerned with keeping what they have
With the way they played this year, if Palmer hadn’t sucked they would have been outstanding. If I had to pick weak spots it would be TE, G, and S. If Kelly comes back to be that extra tackle on the line that occasionally catches a pass and Coffman can be the wideout that makes a few blocks, TE is fine. Between Williams, Mathis, and Livings, we’ve got guards that have played very well this year. I’d like to see a freak of nature guard come in and dominate, but those guys are pretty hard to find. At safety we’ve got solid starters if they keep Crocker and Williams to go with Ndukwe, but again an elite guy would be nice to have. Since the chances of Eric Berry or Taylor Mays being available when the Bengals pick are absolutely nil, and guys like Polamalu & Reed do not get released or traded, this is likely a pipe dream.
There are a lot of impact players that are UFAs and RFAs. With the way the defense performed this year, a lot of low-rent guys are going to be expecting bigger paychecks. Keeping the core guys is going to be more of a challenge than in years past when there was a lot of obvious chaff on the roster.
As far as your "freak of nature Guard" goes, we may already have that guy in the wings in Jason Shirley.
The guy was just murdering defensive linemen in the preseason. With a year of training under his belt there’s a possibility he’ll see some playing time next year. He’s got the chance to be an absolute monster on the O-line.
Fingers crossed.
by Craig Conrad on Jan 11, 2010 6:38 AM EST up reply actions
Josh Cribbs in FA
and do whatever it takes to get Eric Berry in the first round.
by 80%OFTHETIMEIMRIGHTEVERYTIME on Jan 11, 2010 1:27 AM EST reply actions
-FA on Cribbs..
but pick him up, hes unhappy.. let him come here.
by 80%OFTHETIMEIMRIGHTEVERYTIME on Jan 11, 2010 1:27 AM EST up reply actions
First and formost, Simpson?
Really? I’d love to think there’s still untapped potential somewhere, but 2 years, one catch, he’s rarely been good enough to make the active roster. I think we can safely close the book on the guy and try REALLY hard to forget who we could’ve drafted in his place.
1. Brat obviously has to go.
2. I’d like to see us make a play for Marshall or Boldin rather than draft a receiver in the first.
3. Get a new LT and move Whitworth back inside.
4. Cut Daniel Coats in the most dramatic way possible. Maybe clear out his locker and set his belongings on fire outside of PBS.
5. Tons more, but it hurts to even think about this crap right now.
I am not so quick to give up on Simpson
Look at 2 break out stars this year, SIdney Rice and Miles Austin.
Rice was better than Simpson his 1st 2 years, with 31 catches for 396 yards, followed by 15 catches for 141 yards. He broke out this year for 83 catches for 1312 yards.
Austin was closer to Simpson he had 0 catches for 0 yards as a rookie, followed by 5 for 76 yards, his third year he had 13 for 278 before getting 81 for 1320 this year. He came out Monmouth College, a small school, much like Simpson.
Simpson was taken as a project, but it is extremely rare for a rookie WR to have an impact on the NFL, 3 years is a much more standard timeline for development.
Steve Breaston fits perfectly, and other odd observations that Mike Brown won't do
-Pay ungodly amounts to keep Mike Zimmer around (and in place, in case Marvin wants to go to greener pastures next year when his contract is up… imagine him with a team that has a GM and no moron Owner & Fam)
-Pay fair market value for a top complementary receiver (that still has years ahead of him) in Steve Breaston. An upgrade on talent, and could be the next Chad w/o the antics
*Promote Quan to 3rd receiver over Caldwell. Admit it, the Florida WR jinx is real. Quan is simply superios and more Welkerian in that he CATCHES and DOESN’T FUMBLE.
-Let go Brat. Keep the good Coordinator and jettison the bumbling old man. Simple common sense. Won’t happen. Sidenote: let Zampese go off and do his thing. Whatever he is doing as QB coach is NOT WORKING
-FIRE DARRIN SIMMONS, S. Graham both on the same day. No doubt. make a point of it that the perfectionist is far from perfect and we need a change immediately.
-Draft a good kicker, perhaps in the 4th round. But where do we draft a QB, S, and FB or TE??? Who do we get with the 22nd pick? I think if Earl Thomas from UT is available then it is a no brainer. I’d love the idea of McCoy or LeFevroureruxes being the back up to Palmpilot too. (antiquated).
-We need to let go Dan Coats, L. Coles, Jerome Simpson, and we need to make a point of kicking the crap out of J. Johnson for quitting after week 14. Inexcusable lack of effort, as i suspected from the beginning of the season. We let Chris Pressley go, and kept the bum. Classic Brown-ian affair…
- To make up for the TE and WR roster cuts, we need to try out some re-treads, but also look to pay more for rising talent.
FINALLY Let’s get used to the idea that
THESE GUYS ARE ON THEIR LAST LEGS:
(in order)
Carson
Chad
Reggie Kelly
Robert Geathers
Roy Williams
and these 2 guys are bums
Tom Nelson
Rashad Jeanty (sad but true)
by Yaccub Fleishcman on Jan 11, 2010 1:18 PM EST reply actions
One of the best comments I've read in years, from the open thread for Saturday's game over at KSK.
"Today, we’ve secretly replaced Marvin Lewis with Lovie Smith. Let’s see if they notice."
Zimmer Stays. Palmer Stays. Draft a Safety, Receiver, Tight End,and a kicker, in that order. Give Palmer two extra receivers, who don’t drop balls, like it’s their job, and he will be a pro bowler again.
by lifelonghardcorefan on Jan 11, 2010 9:55 PM EST reply actions
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