Bengals Banter: Is concern about the Bengals passing game justified?
A LASTING DEBATE INTO THE OFFSEASON. Dayton Daily News' Greg Billing writes that people should give Carson Palmer a break by giving the quarterback a few more weapons. On principle, it's hard to disagree. Aside from the fact that Chad Ochocinco, compared to his other Pro Bowl seasons, had a down year, no one took advantage of the vacuum left after T.J. Houshmandzadeh's departure.
On the other hand, of the four seasons he didn't make the Pro Bowl, Palmer's passer rating dips to 81.8. Including his two career playoff losses, Palmer has a career starting record of 42-41. And no, he hasn't led the Bengals into a playoff win to date and his 2009 cap value was a team leading $14.3 million; a number that's expected to increase each season. You expect more -- help or not.
But I do agree with Billing when he writes that "the blame for the NFL’s 24th-ranked offense shouldn’t fall on Palmer’s shoulders only." Considering the Bengals rushing offense ranked ninth (which theoretically should help a passing offense), Palmer's weapons were as powerful as pellets from a B.B. gun with only two pumps.
WHAT ARE WE WATCHING HERE? C Trent's daily Thinking Out Loud is one of those posts that I actually sit and wait for, twiddling my thumbs, checking Tweet updates. Yesterday's post included an interesting study by the Wall Street Journal that dissects National Football League broadcasts.
In other words, if you tally up everything that happens between the time the ball is snapped and the play is whistled dead by the officials, there's barely enough time to prepare a hard-boiled egg. In fact, the average telecast devotes 56% more time to showing replays.
So what do the networks do with the other 174 minutes in a typical broadcast? Not surprisingly, commercials take up about an hour. As many as 75 minutes, or about 60% of the total air time, excluding commercials, is spent on shots of players huddling, standing at the line of scrimmage or just generally milling about between snaps. In the four broadcasts The Journal studied, injured players got six more seconds of camera time than celebrating players. While the network announcers showed up on screen for just 30 seconds, shots of the head coaches and referees took up about 7% of the average show.
David Biderman continues:
During last week's Wild Card games, Mr. Crippen, the football researcher, dissected the broadcasts and found about 13 minutes, 30 seconds of action
So now blowouts take on a completely different meaning. Not only is there little action on the field, but the action is damned near meaningless. Go "exciting" NFL playoffs!
DON'T FORGET ABOUT THE DRAFT SCHEDULE. I nearly forgot about this year's new NFL Draft schedule. On Thursday, April 22 at 7:30 PM, the first round will be held. Friday, April 23 at 6:30 PM, it's the second and third rounds. The rest of the draft (rounds four through seven) begins at 10 AM on Saturday, April 24.
Does this go down as the worst decision by the NFL? There was nothing better than packing Saturday and Sunday with draft gossip, waking up early Sunday morning only to resume our charts, analysis and desperate You Tube searches of the new players we picked up.
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I voted for BratWorst (h/t to whomever came up with that moniker)
…but actually, I think it’s mostly BratWorst, with a healthy dose of WRs/TEs having the dropsies…and yes, I’m looking at YOU, Mr. Coats!
The most interesting thing about the new draft schedule will be that there will be loads of negotiating, trades of players and draft picks, etc., leading up to the draft, but then between the 1st and 2nd rounds, there will be, what…20+ hours of opportunity for the Jerry Joneses of the world to do a pile of horse trading. Of course, Mike Brown will do nothing during that time, unless he has an opportunity to trade down to leave another Darnell Dockett on the board so he can draft another Chris freakin’ Perry that we don’t need!
I really thought I had let that one go. I guess I haven’t.
if you're going to be pissed about drafting perry
be pissed that we traded and st louis took steven jackson.
RIP Slim.
i still shake my head when i hear that
" I don't lie, I tell a different version of the truth."
by Purple City Middie on Jan 22, 2010 1:07 AM EST up reply actions
I still drink myself retarded when I hear about passing on S. Jackson
Doing it again right now as a matter of fact
Slim 15, you will be missed. RIP Chris Henry
by Danimal, Destroyer of Worlds on Jan 23, 2010 8:41 PM EST up reply actions
Anyone notice how many good teams this year could run or pass but not both?
+Indy was ranked like 26th in rushing.
+SD’s rushing was ranked 31st (which still shocks me)
+AP hasn’t been that great since MIN became a passing team.
+BAL coun’t pass well unless you count screens to Rice.
+PIT became a passing team but couldn’t run.
You would think that being great at one would help the other but I guess not.
most of those rankings are done by yards..
one of those misleading statistics maybe. If you run more often than throw, you wont rack up the numbers needed to necessarily be ranked high on the list. If our receivers had caught more balls or actually got separation from the guys covering them it might have been a different rumble out of the jungle. However I do think it is notable that you sacrifice one over the other..
by 80%OFTHETIMEIMRIGHTEVERYTIME on Jan 19, 2010 3:44 PM EST up reply actions
I wouldn’t say you have to. I think it’s more a philosophy. Indy runs just enough to keep the opponent semi-honest. But that doesn’t mean you CAN’T be good at both. If you are committed to balance you can get there. If you have an inventive coordinator who can figure out how to use all his weapons to find some way to make them productive. Even if only as decoys.
But you also need good personell and some luck with injuries as well. Some teams started with more balance either last year or this, but lost it due to injuries later on when one method became ineffective. Kinda like us without Henry. But we weren’t the only one.
Some teams find ways to overcome that. BratWorst probably didn’t even realize he needed to try.
I think he uses halftime to catch up on sleep.
forgets to set his alarm and wakes up in the fourth quarter.
by 80%OFTHETIMEIMRIGHTEVERYTIME on Jan 20, 2010 5:24 AM EST up reply actions
palmer has some blame
but something that’s been mentioned a little, but not on here, is his thumb. I don’t think it affected his passes, but it did affect his ability to run the play action effectively. the whole point of being a good running team is being able to get the play action going to open up the passing game. his glove made the play action a dead giveaway and linebackers could key in on it before it got going.
RIP Slim.
Roger Goodell and the NFL Competetion, Owners, and whoever else made the draft decison
All deserve a nice swift kick in the nut sack
My three favorite things in the world in no particular order: My wife, sex with my wife, and The Cincinnati Bengals
My take
OL was subpar at protecting the passer, whether giving up sacks or taking holding penalties.
TE position was down to the 4th, 5th , and 6th stringers when compared to the opening preseason depth chart.
WR included only two players who had caught TD passes from Palmer (Ocho and Henry) before the start of the season (I didn’t bother to see if Caldwell or Simpson caught a pass from CP last season)
Palmer shoulders some of the load as I would imagine returning from an injury that forced him to miss 12 games last season probably doesn’t help. And, yes this is the NFL so even the chopped liver on the roster should be able to contribute, but it was still a poor supporting cast in the passing game.
Ultimately, there was not a lot to work with in the passing game especially with no reliable second pass catching threat consistently showing up throughout the season AND the deduction of a TE who could either stretch the middle of the field, created some sort of positive mismatch, or at last catch the ball when he was wide open (Coats).
Looking towards next season, I am hopeful the secondary pass catcher will develop whether it be someone on the roster, FA acquisition, or drafted player. I am also hopeful the TE position will not be the worst in the league in 2010.
by Cedric Benson Boat Party on Jan 19, 2010 2:39 PM EST reply actions
one of the best weekends of 2008
spending the whole weekend on the couch talking in the open forum on cincyjungle. I had never watched the entire draft but when you have lots of people talking football it is totally worth the time, plus it gives you bragging rights with your buds. Even though they chopped it up into multiple days, which is totally ridiculous, I have already inked in my calendar watching the draft while hanging with cincyjungle. If you have the time it is pretty sweet to see who will be joining our bengal family, well.. if they draft like they did last year.
Im still pissed we didnt pick Tatupu.. haha.
by 80%OFTHETIMEIMRIGHTEVERYTIME on Jan 19, 2010 3:49 PM EST reply actions
Don't Blame Palmer
Losing an experienced Pro Bowl Wide Receiver that knew our Offense and had so much timing with Palmer probably cost the Bengals a shot @ another Super Bowl.
Don't blame the line
9th best in sacks allowed. Considering Palmer has roughly zero mobility , that’s pretty decent. Yeah, Roland sucked and Whitworth set a world record for false starts, but they somehow managed to keep it together. A lot of you will go to ridiculous lengths to defend Palmer. While scapegoating the line without checking the stats may be easy and convenient, that argument belongs in 2008. Holds very little weight.
How about this? Bratkowski has failed to stay ahead of the NFL curve and has a book full of stale plays. He isn’t fooling anyone. Palmer has lost a good deal of confidence and isn’t the same QB he was in 2005….=bad offense. Make sense or am I going off the deep end?
Your right bratdumbass is a freaking retard!
by Diesel2405 on Jan 19, 2010 7:57 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
The bengals offensive playbook is a joke.
Brat has no clue how to score once they are in the redzone! We are not the only people who notice how crappy the benals playbook is. Play madden and use the bengals playbook, madden has tweeked it to suck unbelievably in the game to match that crappiness of it in real life.
by Diesel2405 on Jan 19, 2010 8:00 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Palmer has roughly zero mobility...
until he takes off to grab the 1st down
by Rocket_Man_G on Jan 20, 2010 12:13 AM EST up reply actions
Wait a minute
didn’t Bratkowski make this teama running team for the first time since about 2001? He also did what he could with a no-name O-line.I also like that thing Cincy does when Roland plays wing back and runs in motion. True he made the passing game suck donkey ass but he did help come up with a formula for winning. Run x clock management+ top 5 defense = 10-7 season/division title
"There's no substitute for guts."
-- Paul "Bear" Bryant
Is the goal in the NFL to win your division or the super bowl?
by Diesel2405 on Jan 19, 2010 8:30 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Wait a minute
4-11-1 to 10-7. Amazing improvement? Chea’
"There's no substitute for guts."
-- Paul "Bear" Bryant
This is a stupid argument.
Yes, everybody here is happy that we were 10-7 this year as opposed to 4-11-1.
The Bengals accomplished that in spite of some glaring drawbacks. Bratkowski’s stale, shitty ass playcalling was one of those drawbacks. It was good enough for a division title but it wasn’t good enough for the teams ultimate goal. Improvement is good, but in terms of this discussion, irrelevant.
But ultimately that strategy didn’t work. A ball control offense doesn’t need a spectacular passing game, but it needs an efficient one. 7 yard pass completions shouldn’t be a miracle. Good teams don’t freeze up in the red zone. Frankly, I’d like to steer clear of any comparisons to 2001. That was another team that ran because it had to, not because it was part of some grand offensive scheme.
because their receivers can..
A) catch the ball
B) run routes well enough to get open
C) be utilized through play calling to make big plays
D) all of the above
by 80%OFTHETIMEIMRIGHTEVERYTIME on Jan 20, 2010 5:27 AM EST up reply actions
but it's a style that works
I don’t think they have to reinvent the wheel, just do what they do better and expand on it.
but i personally am not fighting that we need to keep brat, i’d like to see him gone as much as anyone else.
RIP Slim.
I’d say it works to a degree, but I might note that 3 of the 4 remaining teams are pass first. Even the Vikings. It’s all about what you do with your possessions, not how much time you run off the clock. A 7 minute drive that ends in 3 is still just a field goal to me. Give me 2 minutes and 7 on the board any day. But yeah, no matter how you look at it, we can do better. We could trade for Boldin and Marshall and I’d still have little confidence in Brat to design effective schemes.
i will say this though
i’m glad our d can get off the field. i remember far too many games where all we needed was a stop and baltimore or pittsburgh would run it down our throats and take like 8 minutes off the clock at the end of the game.
RIP Slim.
Bratkowski had exactly nothing to do with the performance of the offensive line.
That would be OL coach/assistant head coach Paul Alexander who rightly was given a contract extension last week.
by Craig Conrad on Jan 20, 2010 6:40 AM EST up reply actions
For the main question
Is concern justified? How on earth could it NOT be justified? We’ve gone in only a few years from one of the best to one of the worst, and Carson has gone from accurate to couldn’t hit the broadside of a barn.
Really we need to fix all three, OC, OL, and WR/TE. But it starts at the top. The least competent OC in the league could make the best all-star roster look like crap. The best OC in the league could at least find a way to get something out of even Jamarcus Russell. Probably.
Can't blame the wideout/tights so much.
A great quarterback makes his receivers great. Brady won a Super Bowl with a no name receiving corps. Peyton Manning made stars of Austin freaking Collie and Pierre Garcon. Carson’s become timid and inaccurate. Maybe, just maybe, a competent OC can get something more out of him but I’m not optimistic. Palmer’s become Trent Dilfer.
by IgnatiusJReilly on Jan 20, 2010 1:04 AM EST reply actions
Our WR and TE had a lot of trouble holding on to the ball both before and after the catch
Its awful hard for me to blame those fumbles by Caldwell, Chad, Coats, Leonard and FOshi on Palmer.
Also our offense had a tough time waiting for the snap.
Brady won a Super Bowl with a no name receiving corps
how does matt cassel fit in to your thinking? did he become timid and inaccurate this year? he wasn’t so bad last year.
by andyfrombrooklyn on Jan 20, 2010 4:13 PM EST up reply actions
Brady won a Super Bowl
terry bradshaw won a superbowl because lynn swannn made an insane catch. roger staubach lost a superbowl because jackie smith dropped a ball that hit him in the chest. randy moss made randall cuningham a pro bowl quarterback again for a year. david tyree made a catch on his helmet. eli manning has won a superbowl. ben rothlisberger has a ring because santonio holmes fully extended and caught a pass with his fingertips while dragging his toes inbounds. i could keep going but…that is the point
by andyfrombrooklyn on Jan 20, 2010 4:20 PM EST up reply actions
the carson hating is silly.
the receivers were clearly a weak link. way more drops, fumbles, and no catches than wow that was a great catch. great catches win games. missed field goals lose games.
by andyfrombrooklyn on Jan 20, 2010 4:01 PM EST reply actions
Brady won a Super Bowl with a no name receiving corps
and mark sanchez has won two playoff games with a no name recieving corps. he is where he is because the jets are well coached, physical, and a little lucky. not because he is a good qb.
by andyfrombrooklyn on Jan 20, 2010 4:26 PM EST reply actions
my bold rediction
santa claus is going to get his presents back from the jets this week. the holiday is over. the colt o is going to get some points on the board. the colts d is going to be waiting for sanchez. he is going to be in some pressure situations and he is going to screw up. i can’t wait.
by andyfrombrooklyn on Jan 20, 2010 4:32 PM EST reply actions
Under the Bus
Loss of whosyourmomma was big, but passing attack was thrown under the bus by staff, i dont think it was loss of confidence in Palmer, but receivers.
by sudden death overtime on Jan 20, 2010 7:20 PM EST reply actions

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