Question Of The Day: Change Pass Interference Penalties And Suspensions For Violent Collisions?
by Josh Kirkendall on Oct 18, 2010 2:19 PM EDT
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PrintMaybe it's because there's really nothing to rip on the Bengals. However, Peter King's Monday Morning Quarterback is coupled with several gems that I believe nailed. First off, the current consequence for violent collisions in the NFL, caused by a launching defensive player against a defenseless offensive player, is a joke. What caused the outcry? This Dunta Robinson hit on DeSean Jackson.
The suggestion is more than how much can someone be fined. Rather, King's approach basically suggests that unnecessary mega-hits that result in career threatening collisions should be responded to with six-figure fines and suspensions.
Don't tell me this is the culture we want. It might be the culture kids are used to in video games, but the NFL has to draw a line in the sand right here, right now, and insist that the forearm shivers and leading with the helmet and launching into unprotected receivers will be dealt with severely. Six-figure fines. Suspensions. Ejections.
That being said, a logical "change" in the NFL is King's suggestion that pass interference penalties should be changed. As it stands in the NFL, the penalty is a spot foul; a defensive player is called for a pass interference, the football is placed at the spot of the foul. This allows too much damage for a bad interpretation or, worse still, allows offenses to chuck the football down the field, especially benefit when officials make the call entirely too questionable.
Personal fouls are conduct fouls by players that put other players at serious risk. And those are only 15-yard fouls.
It makes entirely too much sense to change pass interference from a spot foul to a 15-yard penalty. That way an entire game isn't possibly changed from having an officials view of a subjective penalty. Like this.
Question of the Day: Should the NFL change pass interference from a spot foul to a 15-yard penalty?
Question of the Day II: Should violent hits be penalized as six-figure fines and suspensions?
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6 figs
I think six figures is a little extreme. Fines should be a % of their salary, not just a set dollar ampunt. Some safetys and linebackers can afford 100k to lay someone out, and others are only in the league for 2 or 3 years and a six figure fine would be a tenth of their career earnings.
On a side note, I’d like to see the nfl take all of these huge fines and turn it into a positive for the fans. They should use the money to reduce ticket prices. It helps the fans get into the stadiums on sundays and also help prevent local blackouts. If chad has to pay $25 k for a silly fine, at least take that money and help out the fans who make $25k a year.
by Oxailis on Oct 18, 2010 2:56 PM EDT via mobile reply actions
Yeah I agree. I think the fine should be a percentage as well. But it should be a HIGH percentage. Like 50% of a game check at the bare minimum.
I’d like to see them suspend the player who gave out the concussion (if it’s both his fault and a helmet to helmet hit, not simply bad luck from the way they hit the ground) be suspended without pay until the player they laid out is able to come back and play again. And if they never come back, neither does the person who hit them.
THAT will end those hits VERY fast.
I don't think an automatic six figure fine and suspension is justified
At this point, I think most people agree that wasn’t a malicious hit by Dunta Robinson. After all, he knocked himself out, too. How can you possibly justify a multi-game suspension and $100,000+ for something that wasn’t intentional?
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by Dave Choate on Oct 18, 2010 3:25 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
Honestly,
What was Robinson supposed to do, miss him? He was coming full speed ahead to make a play in an important game. You know who should take more blame who really isn’t getting it from the media right now? Kevin Kolb. That he led Jackson into that deathtrap was sinful, and quarterbacks know that they aren’t supposed to put their receivers in situations like that.
It's time to sink or Zim.
by Pardon_My_French on Oct 18, 2010 3:30 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Intentional vs. not
IMHO, I think the debate is moving beyond that, anymore. I mean, I don’t think Robinson’s hit was anything more than an aggressive hit.
But let’s be honest, a hit like that ends a career. This is about preserving careers, livelihoods and in some cases in the near future, lives.
Blogger at CincyJungle.com -- SB Nation Cincinnati Bengals blog.
by Josh Kirkendall on Oct 18, 2010 4:30 PM EDT up reply actions
Was that a bit melodramatic? LOL
Blogger at CincyJungle.com -- SB Nation Cincinnati Bengals blog.
by Josh Kirkendall on Oct 18, 2010 4:31 PM EDT up reply actions
Was that a bit melodramatic? LOL
Maybe.
But it was also accurate. Robinson probably didn’t mean to do that. I’ve never thought much of him when he was a Texan and I thought even less of him when he became a Falcon simply by definition. But he’s not really a deliberately dirty player like many of the Stoolers or Ratbirds. I don’t think he’s really that good… but he’s also not nearly as bad as I wish he was either. But he’s also not deliberately dirty.
That said, intentional or not, the hit was still dirty and dangerous. For both players. And they need to be stopped by just about any means necessary.
if a player launches upwards with his helmet towards and other persons head its a flagarant foul
you can tackle just fine without launching upwards helmet first using it as a spear. i’ve seen plenty of highlight real big hits that don’t involve helmet to helmet. and it isn’t flagrant if the receiver purposely ducks his head into a hit to his torso.
the rules are reasonably clear. occasionally a ref will use discretion we don’t agree with, but we have to accept it. every year a few people die on the field playing football. that hasn’t happened in the NFL yet. but if it does you can guarantee it will change the game forever. and those changes will be a lot bigger then you would like. so lets try to eliminate the most dangerous hits in football that threaten peoples heads.
Flagrant hit?
You leave the game as long as your hittee.
then we have to determine what is flagrant…
and how to prevent a scrub player from playing possum in order to get a Harrison out of the game…
I could sleep when I lived alone.
Is there a ghost in my house?
IMHO if there is helmet contact, incidental of not, the fine should be.....
at least a game check. If the injured player is out of the game, the violater should not be able to play or paid until the injured player is cleared to play again. Some one else here suggested that and I think it is a good idea. Pads on pads it is all good. There is no reason to hit players in the helmet. There are too many neck injuries and concussions. Helmets are for protection and should not be able to be used as a weapon. I am talking about initial contact here, not when the helmet contacts the player in a nonimpact manner.
"If we always agree, one of us is not necessary"
On the interference thing...
I think PI penalties should be reviewable spot fouls. They shouldn’t be reduced in yardage because that provides an incentive to tackle an eligible receiver when he’s in better position 50 yards down the field. However, I’ve long believed that these penalties are too huge to be left up to judgment.
That’s why PI should be reviewable. It wouldn’t really slow the game down, since coaches would still lose a challenge plus a timeout if they’re wrong. All it does is make sure things are accurately called.
And don’t tell me judgment calls aren’t up for review. I know there’s a strict set of guidelines for catching the ball, but the referee still makes a judgment call on whether or not the receiver followed those guidelines. Same goes for PI. There are very specific rules for what is and is not interference. Instant replay will shed some light on the tougher/more terrible calls.
It's time to sink or Zim.
by Pardon_My_French on Oct 18, 2010 3:34 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
Boom SQUARED.
I’ve long (at least as long as I’ve been involved in sports blogs) been a proponent of making everything reviewable. Yeah, yeah, I know, it will never happen. Doesn’t matter, it still needs to.
Fixing the screwed up nature of pass interference not being reviewable would be an enormous step in the right direction.
by FriarBob on Oct 18, 2010 7:08 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
And in the play above, even if they changed it to 15 yards, that’s still 15 yards and a first down because of a terrible call. The only way to fix terrible calls is to unmake those calls, not to simply lessen the punishment on all PI calls.
It's time to sink or Zim.
by Pardon_My_French on Oct 18, 2010 8:43 PM EDT up reply actions
Boom Harroned!
Another thing to consider:
(this is from the buckeye game over the weekend)
There was a replay to see if the receiver caught the ball (and, if so, whether it was for first down yardage). The replay showed that the ball bumped with the ground and was, rightly, overturned to a no – catch.
The replay also clearly showed that the defender had wrapped the receiver and had already changed the receivers positioning before the ball was caught. Something flagrant (probably wrong word usage) like that should be acknowledged and called during the review. I could see not allowing the review just to determine that, but if it suddenly becomes obvious and the play is being overturned, something that could have caused the non-catch should be considered.
proably a bit wordy, so I’ll just say, instead: “Stillers suck!”
I could sleep when I lived alone.
Is there a ghost in my house?
by supergrover on Oct 19, 2010 10:39 AM EDT up reply actions
Yes for Fines
I absolutely think they should be fined six figures, maybe a sliding scale based on salary. It would have to be pretty blatant to throw a guy out of a game. I would agree with that being reviewable. Bad flagrant fouls in the NBA are reviewable, a personal foul like that should be too. Suspensions should have a full appeals process and all that, maybe have a board agreed upon by the league and the NFLPA.
They need to have something more stringent than current rules, especially with guys like Harrison being proud of hurting two players, especially that hit on Massaquoi. The culture has to change or more stars are going to get knocked out of games and more importantly, a bunch of brain damage injuries will continue to happen.
yes to 15yd interference call
the spot call for interference is bullshit and should’ve been changed LONG ago. 15yds is fair for that (although IMO the spot foul was supposed to deter defenders from interfering, and a 15yarder would probably mean way more deep interference calls). Still, i’m all for changing that. 6 figure fines….bullshit, that is WAY too much money for a subjective/objective call (couldn’t remember which is which). they should be 25-45K fines and an ejection if necessary. Suspensions, again too much grey area, but ejections would atleast level the playing field for the time being during the games in which the hits are deemed ’too extreme" or whatever
Pass Interference should be 15 yards like college ball. It also changed the outcome of the Ravens game (thank god). It’s not good for the game when teams can launch the ball down the field and draw a PI call a huge percentage of the time.
These helmet to helmet hits are easy to hands. If you concuss a player, you’re suspended for every game that he misses as a result. For example, Ward would have had to sit out a week just like Shipley.
Fines are nothing to most of these players, it’s missing play time that will get them to change.
isn’t this coded from beyond Josh’s determination?
I could sleep when I lived alone.
Is there a ghost in my house?
by supergrover on Oct 19, 2010 10:44 AM EDT up reply actions
"huge percentage of the time"?
I don’t think deep PI’s are frequent. I don’t think we see even one per game (maybe on average, but not every game).
Hard to determine what is concussed. If I take a hard hit, can I be the inverse of an “enforcer” and just be a great actor and go limp or even twitchy after Harrison or Ray Lewis pops me?
I could sleep when I lived alone.
Is there a ghost in my house?
by supergrover on Oct 19, 2010 10:44 AM EDT up reply actions
Helmet to Helmet hit should be called everytime
regardless of intention. But if its not helmet to helmet, then what’s wrong? There was nothing wrong with that hit on D. Jackson it was a shoulder to the chest was he supposed to let him run by then tackle him from behind? If they want to throw flags for a clean hit like that then James Harrison should be suspended for 2 helmet to helmet hits that took both players out the game. Consistency Mr.Goodel consistency.
" I don't lie, I tell a different version of the truth."
by Purple City Middie on Oct 18, 2010 4:54 PM EDT reply actions
does anyone else
see the irony of players whining about playing 18 games and then talking about how hard they’re going to hit each other and how the game is “too soft?”
RIP Slim.
by brandone on Oct 18, 2010 4:59 PM EDT reply actions 4 recs
How in the world was that pass interference on Flowers?
Basically the refs helped the Texans win that game.
+1
I am becoming a conspiracy theorist these days. I mean, Texas has to have ONE good team this year (right?).
This is our year!
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