Six NFL Players Have More Quarterback Sacks Than Entire Bengals Defense

by Josh Kirkendall on Oct 27, 2010 8:00 PM EDT in Analysis

Through six games this year, the Cincinnati Bengals defense has only recorded six quarterback sacks -- that's only one less sack than Antwan Odom's performance against the Green Bay Packers last year, recording five sacks (albeit against lesser talent). There was also a two-game stretch against Baltimore and Pittsburgh that the Bengals defense recorded eight quarterback sacks. Both were wins, in case you forgot the whole undefeated division thing from last year.

Of the six quarterback sacks this year by the Bengals defense, three came against the Tampa Bay Buccaneers. What's even more distressing, if not absolutely horrifying, is that only two of the defense's six quarterback sacks have come from defensive linemen; Frostee Rucker 1, Michael Johnson 0.5, Gene Atkins 0.5. The team's leading quarterback sacker? A safety in Chris Crocker.

If you really want to put the Bengals pass rush into perspective.

Six NFL players have recorded more sacks than the entire Bengals defense; Clay Matthews (8.5), Osi Umenyiora (8.0), DeMarcus Ware (8.0), Brian Orakpo (7.0), Shaun Phillips (7.0), James Hall (6.5).
Eleven NFL players have as many or more sacks than the entire Bengals defense; players listed above, John Abraham (6.0), Jason Babin (6.0), Dave Ball (6.0), Trent Cole (6.0), Cameron Wake (6.0).
There are 54 NFL players that have more quarterback sacks than the entire Bengals defensive line combined.

Any questions?

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Nope no questions.

Our front 7 is a joke. We have an overrated worthless outside LB in Rivers, who can not blitz worth a shit but also is a liability in passcoverage. Our Middle LB is like 56 yrs old,slow and makes a ton of tackles 8-10 yds downfield, and has no reason to ever be on the field in passing situations. Our other outside LB is a flipping MLB and that’s where he needs to play. I am sick of tired of them moving people out of the natural spots. (see pollack, who was a completely useless LB). Peko is the only person who is any good on the D-Line so he gets double teamed almost every single time.Odom,Geathers and Sims are waste of roster space who get absolutely no pressure on the QB at all. We drafted a DE in the 2nd rd who they refuse to play. Johnson is tall and fast for a DE but he doesnt seem to ever play. Fanene is hurt. Ruckers is a turd who doesnt play either and Atkins who seems to be able to cause a pass rush continues to ride the pine. Again we have been saying this forever FO and Coaching Staff is a joke.

by Diesel2405 on Oct 27, 2010 8:35 PM EDT reply actions

Oh yeah. FIRE BRATKOWSKI

by Diesel2405 on Oct 27, 2010 8:36 PM EDT up reply actions

I'm not sold on MJ

I feel like every time I see him, he’s getting easily blocked, and he’s not at all effective against the run. I’m wondering if the reason Zimmer hasn’t switched to a 3-4 is because he knows MJ won’t be effective in that hybrid LB/DE spot. When you think about it, we have a lot of lineman who would fit in a 3-4 – Atkins, Fanene, and Rucker all seem to be protypical 3-4 DEs. The other problem besides not having a Harrison/Ware type LB though is I’m not sure we really have a prototype 3-4 NT (I don’t think Peko and Sims are big enough).

Ultimately, a 4-3 is too predictable since you have 4 guys down every play, and unless the DEs are quick enough (i.e. Freeney & Mathis) to beat their opposing offensive tackles one-on-one, you aren’t going to have much pass rush. Oddly, our DEs are bigger and more run-oriented – not to mention overrated based on fluke years.

Moisture is the essense of wetness, and wetness is the essense of beauty.

by Blue Steel on Oct 27, 2010 9:41 PM EDT up reply actions

To switch to a 3-4 all we would have to do is draft a nose tackle and a cover safety.

I would love for us to switch to the 3-4. Cincinnati made the 3-4 zone blitz famous in the 80’s with Dick Lebeau. I admit that I have never been a huge fan of the 4-3 defense.

We have 2 players in Micheal Johnson and Geno Atkins as far as size that don’t really fit a 4-3 and we are getting nothing out of them. We have Brandon Johnson who has the size and speed to cover tight ends, who rarely ever sees the field. Put Atkins in and move him around depending on the need for a pass rush. We have Peko, T. Johnson, Sims, or Fanene, to play the end position. Get Dhani’s brains and Maualuga’s brawn in the middle. Our corners are fine and we have safeties that can play up on the line.

We have to get a cover safety and a tackle anyways. We have a stable of line backers we could benefit from if we got them on the field. We have some dead weight on the D-Line we need to get rid of. If Geathers can’t be a back up line backer, then cut him. Definitely cut Odom, Rucker and R. Williams. If Dunlap can’t make a go of it, cut him too. I would keep Sims as a backup because of his size.

NT – (Missing), Peko

DE – Peko, T.Johnson, Sims, Fanene, Atkins

OLB – Keith Rivers, Skuta

MLB – Mauluga, D.Jones (calling the plays), Muckelroy

OLB – B. Johnson, M. Johnson (always on the tight end)

RCB – Hall, A. Jones (nickle corner), Trent

LCB – Joseph, Ghee

SS – Ndukwe, R. Nelson or (G. Wilson, if we bring him back)

FS – (Missing), Crocker

MIKE BROWN STEP DOWN!!!

by D-Day77 on Oct 28, 2010 3:01 AM EDT up reply actions

I think that lineup would get man-handled by the run

I like Peko and Atkins at the DE spots – they’re both quick and big/strong enough to hold their own in the 3/4 gaps. Sims might be able to hold down the NT position. Not sure about Tank really fitting in. But I would see the opposing offense running right at either Rivers or MJ/BJ who wouldn’t be able to hold their ground. I think we need a big, strong, LB to play the strong side (like a Harrison/Ware/Thomas type) or the weak side if we shift the D-line over – which we don’t have. And yes, we need a cover safety.

The question though is who do we draft with our top picks? I still think we need to get an interior offensive lineman in either the first or second round. And given our lack of scouting, we’d need to pick up either a NT or LB with the other top 2 pick, otherwise were banking on fool’s (MB) luck. I’m thinking we should pick up a cover safety (unless Reggie Nelson can deliver) and either LB(s) or NT through FA. Unfortunately I see MB letting JJo go just to afford this…. ugh

Moisture is the essense of wetness, and wetness is the essense of beauty.

by Blue Steel on Oct 28, 2010 10:34 AM EDT up reply actions

It's all about the scheme.

The thing that makes the 3-4 work is that you don’t know where the 4th rusher is coming from or who is going to drop into coverage.

Tank isn’t doing much in the 4-3 and he played in the 3-4 at Dallas. He hasn’t really produced much for us anyways.

As far as outside linebackers: Demarcus Ware is 6-4 262, James Harrison is 6-0 242 (pretty small), while Micheal Johnson is 6-7 268, Brandon Johnson is 6-5 240, they are basically the same size as the players you suggested. So I don’t understand what you mean about them not being big enough.

As far as nose tackle: Steelers Casey Hampton 6-1 325 and Chris Hoke 6-2 305. Ravens Hgoli Nata 6-4 350 and Terrence Cody 6-4 349. Domota Peko 6-3 320, Pat Sims 6-2 325.

Your size argument doesn’t seem to be an issue. Our guys are just as big. Again, all we have to do is draft a 350 lb. nose tackle and all of the personnel is in place, and we can get rid of some of the dead weight.

1st round O-Line

2nd round NT

3rd round FS

And there you go, we can dump R. Williams, R. Geathers, A. Odom, T. Johnson, C. Dunlap (if needed) although I would like to see him work out, and F. Rucker.

MIKE BROWN STEP DOWN!!!

by D-Day77 on Oct 28, 2010 2:48 PM EDT up reply actions

I guess I was thinking more in terms of leverage

I don’t think MJ/BJ have very good leverage. Yea, Harrison may only be 242, but he tears up linemen and is like a human wrecking ball. But, I’m encouraged by the fact that Hampton is only 325. I thought he was bigger than that. And looking at Vince Wilfork, he’s apparently only 6-2/325. Though, I’d rather see Peko at DE and Sims backing up at NT.

I like your picks at the bottom, though am anxious to see if Nelson (Reggie – not Tom) pans out. If he does, then I’d consider using our 3rd pick for another linemen, LB, or possibly even reciever??

Moisture is the essense of wetness, and wetness is the essense of beauty.

by Blue Steel on Oct 28, 2010 4:54 PM EDT up reply actions

We would need to add some depth to the LB spot.

James Harrison and Demarcus Ware are special players, you don’t have to sell me on that. There are only a few guys in this league that can do what they do, that is what makes them so special. Maybe with the right scheme some of our players may flourish.

I originally had Sims as a backup NT, but I took him off, I just wanted to try and keep it simple. Any player on my depth chart will obviously have to be moved around depending on the situation. And I am sure that their are guys that I have listed at backups that might play better than the guys I have listed as starters in the 3-4 scheme.

One thing that I think this team has a hard time with, is advertising what they are trying to do with the personnel groupings that they put on the field. Hopefully a 3-4 scheme would take some of that away.

The outside linebacker’s will flip depending on which side the tight end lines up on, and I like the size match up that MJ/BJ can provide on covering the tight end. Our safeties have been covering the tight ends so far this year and we haven’t done a very good job stopping them.

I would also like for us to try and run the 4-4 scheme when the other team is down inside our 15 yard line. They did that a few times last year and it worked. I like having big bodies in there on a short field, it makes finding receivers more difficult and you have that extra lineman to help stop the run.

MIKE BROWN STEP DOWN!!!

by D-Day77 on Oct 29, 2010 1:35 AM EDT up reply actions

They have Geno Atkins listed as a NT on our depth chart!

I thought that was kind of interesting…

MIKE BROWN STEP DOWN!!!

by D-Day77 on Oct 29, 2010 1:38 AM EDT up reply actions

I noticed that too

Maybe because he’s not big enough to play over guards, they figure he can overpower most centers? But then again, he doesn’t play over center often when he’s in. Or maybe its because they didn’t want to have two players listed behind Tank and none behind Peko on the depth chart? I would take anything you find on Bengals.com (I assume that’s where you saw that) with a grain of salt…..

Moisture is the essense of wetness, and wetness is the essense of beauty.

by Blue Steel on Oct 29, 2010 8:31 AM EDT up reply actions

I'd love it if we ran a 3-4

by Throw the ball on Oct 28, 2010 10:57 AM EDT up reply actions

3-4

I think a major part of the problem is drafting guys that really dont fit the Bengals system. I think Dunlap and M. Johnson would be much better served in a 3-4 (similar to how the skins use Orakpo). Would love to see some looks this year with this personnel group (espeically in obvious passing downs)

DE- Rucker NT- Peko DE- Atkins

OLB- M. Johnson ILB Maulaluga ILB Rivers OLB Dunlap

by Crew Jones on Oct 29, 2010 10:01 AM EDT up reply actions

Geathers isn't bad against the Run

which is not what he’s overpaid for.

by occams_tiger_teeth on Oct 28, 2010 12:12 AM EDT up reply actions

So...

What you’re trying to say is there a problem with quarterback pressure? :-) I’m really surprised we never added Adalius Thomas when we worked him out. He had to be better than what we had.

I’m also surprised we haven’t tinkered more with a 3-4 defense.

by Dvdbumpus on Oct 27, 2010 9:10 PM EDT reply actions

"I’m really surprised we never added Adalius Thomas when we worked him out."

Neither did 31 other teams which means he is burnt out.

by smoormandiddy on Oct 28, 2010 7:52 AM EDT up reply actions

and ppl didnt listen when i said

during draft season that our pass rush was our weakest area, I really hate bein right this time

by Jaydolla on Oct 27, 2010 9:26 PM EDT reply actions

Zim must have listened

We used our 2nd round pick on a “pass-rusher,” which some might call a “bench-warmer”

This is our year!

by Paul Cannon on Oct 28, 2010 9:34 AM EDT up reply actions

Way to go Zimmer, way to go.

by jimbasa on Oct 27, 2010 10:37 PM EDT reply actions

This isn't really Zimmer's fault

as much as it is the three people who are not secretarial staff who are employed as Bengals “scouts”, and the cheap SOB who has the fifth or sixth lowest payroll in the league right now rather than filling the holes that were actually obvious last year. During the last 11 games where the Bengals are 3-8 they have had no pressure on the QB and the safeties have been exposed as big liabilities.

by occams_tiger_teeth on Oct 28, 2010 12:13 AM EDT up reply actions