I Smell Dynasty
by BeerRun on Jul 13, 2010 8:08 PM EDT
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PrintAnd I'm not talking about cheesy Eighties prime-time soaps.
Is "the window" opening or closing? It's a question all NFL fans ask about their teams, and in the Cincinnati Bengals' case, I think the answer is clear: the window is opening.
The Bengals, coming off a division championship, are by far the youngest team in the AFC North. In fact, the three other teams in the division all rank among the top five-oldest squads in the league, while the Bengals are right in the middle of the pack.
Even more interesting is that the response by the rest of the division to the Bengals' division-topping 2009 performance was...to get older. Here's the same numbers from last September. Going into last season, the Bengals were the seventh-youngest team in the league, while the Ravens, Browns and Steelers were 12, 21 and 26, respectively. Right now, those teams are all ranked 28+ on the youth scale.
Obviously, these figures are subject to change once camp cuts start, but to longtime fans like yours truly, accustomed to the "perpetual rebuild" strategy the front office perfected in the Nineties, and which seemed to be carrying over into the Aughts as late as 2008, this is an astonishing development.
After a blip of success in 2005, the team decayed at an astonishing rate: between the end of 2005 and the start of the 2009, the Bengals lost their center, two starting tackles, a starting RB, two high-draft-pick starting LBs, their No. 1 wideout spent a year on the crazy train, and their No. 2 WR left for Seattle despite their best efforts. By the end of the '08 train wreck, it was fair to expect that the Bengals would need a few years to dig out from the rubble.
But a funny thing happened in 2009. The Bengals, it appears, actually managed to pull off a rarely seen (in Cincinnati, at least) "reload on the fly." An offensive line consisting of a couple vets and a bunch of undrafted free agent types failed to suck. High draft picks didn't (for the most part) bust. The dumpster-diving instincts of the front office finally paid off in the person of Cedric Benson. And then there's Mike Zimmer, whose arrival can only be explained by divine intervention.
The result is that the Bengals are in a position to not just win, but to dominate the division for the foreseeable future.
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Love it!!!!!!
Please MB do not f this up.
We are definitely getting better in the development and acquiring talent department. Next is contract negotiations Long term w in our division will be a battle of attrition w walrus getting in the mix. We all know how well run the Steelers and Ravens operate. We should encourage MB ( can’t muster writing his name) to finally live up to his expectations and bloodline and make this f in happen . you got our county by the balls at least let us enjoy it.W that said… I love this team… Get em MJ. Can’t wait to be the one smiling after the superbowl. WHO DEY!!!
by quickslant on Jul 13, 2010 9:14 PM EDT via mobile reply actions
How old is Palmer
I think that smell might be Geritol.
Then the Ravens locker room....
must reek of Geritol considering there are twice as many players over 30 on the Ravens as on the Bengals.
There’s the banter…
But seriously, we know 30 isn’t that old for a quarterback. Most would still have at least 5 maybe even 10 yrs left in them.
by Oregonbengalsfan on Jul 13, 2010 10:14 PM EDT up reply actions
Second string quarterback
If Palmer were to go down, who would fill in. One guy has the same last name but can either run an offense. One smart move the Ravens made was to pick up Bulger. His last couple years with the Rams weren’t great, but with that offense I don’t Jesus would have done better than 8-8.
honestly though
you really think bulger is going to win a superbowl for you? no. if flacco goes down, your chances are out the window too. you have a better chance to win more games, but you’re not winning a superbowl. very very few teams could go far in the playoffs if their #1 goes down. Philly being one, maybe tennessee. that’s about it off the top of my head.
RIP Slim.
Talking about Bulger?
he has never been a member of a SB winning team.
by Cedric Benson Boat Party on Jul 14, 2010 11:23 AM EDT up reply actions
My bad. Warner, Bulger, same difference ;-)
But he has been a pro bowl QB 2x and has some impressive stats. With a decent line he might do pretty good as a back up.
Thanks
2010 - The Year of the Tiger.
If Flacco does go down, Bulger will be a serviceable replacement for us. Will we win the Superbowl, probably not. But if the Ravens and Bengals both lost their starting QB’s, I think it is safe to say the Ravens would have a better chance than you guys would.
If Flacco goes down, Bulger will do an excellent Brunell imitation (incompetent moron who should have retired 10 years ago). Bulger could teach the position just fine. Play it for real? Stick a fork in him, he’s done.
If Carson goes down, whomever our backup is will do an excellent JaMarcus imitation.
So either way, we’re both screwed if our QB goes down.
Bulger is far from done, trust me the Ravens would not have offered him a contract if we thought he had nothing left. If you are really making this judgment based on what he has done the last few seasons, then you are wrong. The guy was playing on the worst team in football over the last 3 years. His O-Line has been crap and his WR has been crap, you think he was going to do well?
Bulger >>>>> any backup QB you have. Ravens could still very well make the playoffs with Bulger.
Tkts. are the key
The core is here now for success and a dynasty but only if we buy tickets. Can’t keep calling them sell outs by giving tickets away and still have the money to keep this team together.
Its gotta make business sense.....
You’re right
by quickslant on Jul 13, 2010 10:40 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
NFL..
However its different than starting up a tire shop. Were talkin big buisiness crossed w tax revenue and such.. Its you vs 32
by quickslant on Jul 13, 2010 10:43 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
I am as big of a Bengals fan as anyone here but seriously................
lets just wait till we win a playoff game before we ever have the word dynasty and Bengals in the same sentence. Remember first it is the horse and then the cart. OK?
"If we always agree, one of us is not necessary"
this is an instant classic
only bengals fans would be talking dynasty after one division title. So stereotypical it’s funny.
"It was an attrition football game and you know we like that."
I am glad someone else got a good laugh out of this
"I'm from Maryland, and no one can beat me!"
by John Stephens on Jul 14, 2010 9:00 AM EDT up reply actions
Well, for those of us who can count, we’ve actually won two division titles in the last 5 years. Just sayin.
This is our year!
Everyday when I go to the office
I walk past 6 lombardi trophies, not 6 division title trophies.
There is no dark side of the moon really .. .. .. matter of fact it's all dark
by chewiesteeler on Jul 14, 2010 9:33 PM EDT up reply actions
The area where you work
I think I know that area. It’s right by 9-7 Alley and Can’tCloseGames Parkway right? And if I remember right, it’s just off MissedthePlayoffs Highway.
This is our year!
by Paul Cannon on Jul 14, 2010 10:40 PM EDT up reply actions
Yeah dude
whatever helps you sleep at night. I think it almost might be near Haven’t won a playoff game in __ years BLVD.
There is no dark side of the moon really .. .. .. matter of fact it's all dark
by chewiesteeler on Jul 14, 2010 11:05 PM EDT up reply actions
I notice that you’re not talking about your current team. Care to elaborate?
If you want to come over here and talk football then by all means come over here and talk football. If you feel like telling us why you think that the Steelers will have a better year than predicted, then by all means, tell us and we’ll listen (just ask NY Steelers Fan if you don’t believe me). If you’re coming over to the Cincy Jungle to stir sh!t up, then please don’t bother.
This is our year!
by Paul Cannon on Jul 15, 2010 12:08 PM EDT up reply actions
I'm sorry
No, I’m talking about the ridiculous inclusion of the word Dynasty in this post. Generally speaking, the word Dynasty starts getting thrown around when a team has already won multiple Super Bowls in a relatively short period of time, say, 2 in three years such as the Patriots in early 00’s. This guy is tossing aroud the word Dynasty when disccussing a team that hasn’t even won a playoff game. Come on now.
As for the competition level in the AFC North, yeah, great discussion. With the possible exception of the Browns, the AFC North is beginning to resemble the extremely tough, competitive division it has been in the past. I still think the best Defense resides in Pittsburgh, for now, with Cincy rising fast.
As for the Steelers overall? Going into every year I assume they will split with Cincy and Baltimore. As long as the Steelers have Ben, they are going to win more games than they lose. I’m pretty confiedent they will come out the other side of his supsension at least 2-2 and then go 9-3 or 8-4 the rest of the way.
Everyone (particulary Cincinatti fans) is so quick to claim that this is a team on decline based on one sub par season. Please. There have been few teams in this league as consistent year over year than Pittsburgh. As much as you would hate to admit it, if you look over the data, it is overwhelmingly conclusive.
There is no dark side of the moon really .. .. .. matter of fact it's all dark
by chewiesteeler on Jul 16, 2010 10:08 AM EDT up reply actions
I think the argument
is more that you have a very old roster, and some of your best players are going past thier prime into retirement age. I think this year was the last one where you would have enough weapons to really be still considered a top team, but between losing players to injuries and a weak trade and a key 4 game suspension all before training camp even opens, your hopes are dashed. Just the way I see it anyway.
It turns out I overestimated my apathy, but not enough to matter.
Old Roster
Yet somehow, year over year, they manage to replenish, win games, go to playoffs, etc. etc. Besides, some of our best players are youngsters:
Woodley
Timmons
Wallace
Miller
Roethlisberger
Hood (TBD?)
Pouncey (TBD?)
I can see from your point of view. I’m just saying, don’t overlook the consistency of this organization. Steelers will win at least 10 games this year. By the end of the season, some of the younger names you haven’t even heard of on this team likely will have emerged to enter the conversation as “some of your best players” a la James Harrison. Ever hear of him before he started destroying QBs?
"If a man watches three football games in a row, he should be declared legally brain dead." I say, "What a way to die." - Steve Sabol responding to an Erma Bombeck quote
by chewiesteeler on Jul 22, 2010 11:24 AM EDT up reply actions
I should rephrase it
and say some of the better players in the league. Now, Woodley is on that list for sure, but most of the other guys you had at the top of the league in thier postions are now past thier primes. Yes, others could emerge, but any fan of a team could say the same thing about thier players. Them actually becoming that is a different story in itself.
It turns out I overestimated my apathy, but not enough to matter.
Yikes dude
1st – I didn’t put anyone at the top of the league in their positions
2nd – If you mean Miller and Ben are past their primes, well, I don’t really know what to say. The other guys are 1st to 3rd year guys. Come now.
Any way, as they say, the proof is in the pudding. Fun to go back and forth and speculate but lets reconvene sometime at the end of December, eh? We’ll see who has gone in which direction.
If I had to guess, I’d say Pitt goes 4-2 in the divison, splitting with Baltimore and Cinci (no way you guys sweep Pitt 2 years in a row). Overall, I have ’em going 11-5: 2-2 while Ben is out and 9-3 in the 12 games he plays. Would not surprise me if 3 P/O teams come from the North.
"If a man watches three football games in a row, he should be declared legally brain dead." I say, "What a way to die." - Steve Sabol responding to an Erma Bombeck quote
by chewiesteeler on Jul 23, 2010 10:14 AM EDT up reply actions
Our communication
It’s just not there. I honestly don’t feel like trying to work through it because we’ll never come to an agreement. I would be pretty shocked to see the Steelers go 11-5, and I would feel pretty confident saying that the Bengals are going to come out with a better record than the Steelers. I would also be amazed if 3 playoff teams came out of the north. The East is going to try to be putting 2 or 3 in there too. And the NFC North faces the AFC East this year. It’s going to be a dogfight the whole way through and some team from the AFC west (who play each other and the NFC west) will have to be much less of a team to make the post season, they just have to make a decent stride to have a complete turn around season. So you gotta throw that into the equation. All in all, if you are so confident that the Steelers are going to win 11 games, you should bet the over. It’s not even close to that. I would make a friendly wager myself on that 11 game mark, but you could get a lot more leeway with the house.
It turns out I overestimated my apathy, but not enough to matter.
Missed the playoffs
And still won as many PO games as you did
"I'm from Maryland, and no one can beat me!"
by John Stephens on Jul 15, 2010 10:16 AM EDT up reply actions
Pharmaceutical company
Do the companies that make performance enhancing drugs also get trophies of the teams they helped win super bowls for.
Great argument
Conveniently overlook the fact that every team in the league at the time was doing the same thing.
There is no dark side of the moon really .. .. .. matter of fact it's all dark
by chewiesteeler on Jul 16, 2010 10:10 AM EDT up reply actions
Every team in the league was not doping up on steroids. Without steroids the Stealers would not have been the same team. Without stick-em the Raiders would not have been the same team either. I guess that old saying is true “If you’re not cheating, you’re not trying hard enough”. You’re trophies are on the same shelf with the Patriots of the new decade.
If you think the Steelers were the only team
that was doing that, you, my friend, are dillusional.
Also, it was NOT illegal at the time, now, was it?
"If a man watches three football games in a row, he should be declared legally brain dead." I say, "What a way to die." - Steve Sabol responding to an Erma Bombeck quote
by chewiesteeler on Jul 22, 2010 11:17 AM EDT up reply actions
How many PO games did you win after those?
Please stop trying to representing the AFC North.
"I'm from Maryland, and no one can beat me!"
by John Stephens on Jul 15, 2010 10:16 AM EDT up reply actions
B to the double E to the Double R U N
is just excited.
Lets win the SB before we use the phrase dynasty. At the very least we should be going to the playoffs for several years in a row. But for now. Not a dynasty.
2010 - The Year of the Tiger.
Ravens-related things that made me LOL
—us sweeping you
—your overall record against Carson-led Bengals teams
—Flacco’s postseason performance against the Patriots (yeah, you won, but with an elderly defense)
Look, you guys are a good organization, and you’ve made strides that we haven’t—but we’ve done well against you, and assuming that this last year was just an outlier…well, you know what happens when you assume.
by Big Sky Bengal on Jul 14, 2010 1:16 PM EDT up reply actions
I guess we can both agree on that one.
This is our year!
by Paul Cannon on Jul 14, 2010 10:40 PM EDT up reply actions
And I am not assuming anything. I think you guys could very well have another winning season, but since you are basing so many assumptions off the past then I will do the same thing and say that you guys could very well have a losing season like you have done the last 30+ years.
Your team got better, my team got better so lets see what happens. Can’t wait.
I figured you would chime in MaLor. Like a shark to a wounded fish.
We are not by any means a dynasty. What we are, and I think many will agree, is a team that is set up to be contenders for several years if things can continue as they have over the last several years. We have improved more over the last three yerars than any team in the division with consideration to the fact that we had the most room for improvement. I think the Steelers and Ravens will have to take the automatic win over the Bengals mark off of their schedules and put it in the colunm marked possible losses.
"If we always agree, one of us is not necessary"
Its hard to argue with that.
This team is set up to be good. Dynasty though? Way too early to make that statement. But we are several things. We are young, we are talented, and we are deep. That’s a recipe for winning into the future IMO.
So true JJ
I really love the position that this team is in and I would give us a good 4-5 year window to at least stay competitive with the players we have. Dynasty? Definitely not at this point in time. Strong team with a lot of upside? Without a doubt.
This is our year!
I agree with all of this. This is probably the best Bengals team I have seen since the Ravens have come into the NFL, mostly because your defense is actually starting to match your offense. However, for a fan to say that he smells a dynasty after not having done anything relevant in this league for nearly 30 years is a little silly, as I am guessing you agree with.
I mean, this franchise has not had back to back winning seasons since 76’-77’ I believe, so what makes me believe that you guys are actually for real? Because you swept a AFC North division that was limping through the entire season? Because you guys squeeked by the Ravens in each match up last year? I think even Cinci fans need to see PLAYOFF wins before creating a post like this, which is why I found it rather humorous.
Not sure about the back to back winning seasons stat, it might be 81’-82’ or 86’-87’ judging by the standings I am looking at now. All I know is that it has been a very, very long time.
MaLor, please just try to be objective and respectful, especially here in our board
The first paragraph was excellent and appropriate and then you start in with what really torques me about Ravens and Steeler fans. Every team is responsibel for the team they put on the field. When you beat a big time injured Bengal team without Carson Palmer in 08 I am sure you considered it a legit win – and it was. The Bengals swept the division and I don’t think the Ravens or Steelers have done that. The Bengals don’t deserve to have the acomplishment diminished with the excuse that the division was limping. The truth is that nobody in the division beat us and we beat all of them twice. The Bengals deserve credit for that and I don’t think it is too much to ask.
The second thing is a win is a win if it is by 20 points or 1 points. One time could be luck, I will give you that but it takes more than luck to beat 2 god teams twice. I think the Bengals deserve credit for that too. Your team has had its days of glory and so have the Steelers. I find it very disapointingly small of Steeler and Ravens fans not to simply say good win, good game, we will see you next year. Here in Ohio we learned to do that in Pony League baseball at the age of 12.
I am not here saying we are going to whip the Ravens or Steelers this year. I am just saying that the Bengals will be there when you show up and we will do all we can to beat you and if you win I will say god game, good win, see you next game because that is what sportsmen do. No excuses. No blaming injuries or the refs. If we don’t win that just means we have to get better. Belittling an opponent doesn’t make you any better. It just makes you look small. What ever happened to winning with class and losing with grace? Good win, good game, see you next game. I miss that.
"If we always agree, one of us is not necessary"
I thought I was being very objective and respectful. I thought my comment was appropriate for the opinion I have about your team. I did not once use personal attacks or state something that was just idiotic like other fans.
Your team has had its days of glory and so have the Steelers.
I hope this is not saying that our team is done. I would think it isn’t, just making sure.
I find it very disapointingly small of Steeler and Ravens fans not to simply say good win, good game, we will see you next year.
Good game, good win. And as I stated in a comment above, “Your team got better, my team got better so lets see what happens. Can’t wait.”
For whatever that last paragraph implies, I have never once taken anything away from your two wins against us last year. You guys beat us. The first time I thought was a fluke, the 2nd time proved me wrong. Congrats. I just hope that Cinci fans don’t continue to live in the past and use what happened last year as a basis for what you want to accomplish this year. Because what I have noticed about the NFL is that teams who don’t live in the now fall very quickly.
You have to see the opinion I have about the Bengals from my point of view. My entire Ravens fan hood, the Bengals have not been a threat to me. Yes, Carson is 7-3 against us or whatever it is, but consistently you guys are a team that doesn’t play football in January. We are, and you guys supported my opinion once again by falling out of the playoffs while we were taking steps toward getting to the Superbowl. Yes, we both failed in accomplishing the ultimate goal, but which team had a better season, the team who won in the regular season (Bengals) or the team who won in the post season (Ravens)? I know it was only one win, but it was our way of showing that we were for real at least more than you guys were.
See you in week 2. Goodnight.
MaLor, on your board I don't care what you post. That is your home.
This is out home. At least give us the respect in our own home of being truthful.
You said you never once have taken anything away from your two wins while, right before my lying eyes in the previous post you said we squeeked by you and a limping division. I am not really worried about the respect of Ravens or Steeler fans. But at least be honest with yourself if not with us.
I stopped posting on your board to avoid silly assed arguments like this. Please keep this crap over there. I would consider it a personal favor.
"If we always agree, one of us is not necessary"
Using history to judge the future is pretty silly notion don’t you think? I agree about the “dynasty” thing (However, if this team did turn into a dynasty, BeerRun would have ultimate dibs on having called it), but let’s not pretend that the 80’s & 90’s have anything to do with the players who we are putting on the field in 2010.
This is our year!
by Paul Cannon on Jul 14, 2010 10:48 PM EDT up reply actions
Using history to judge the future is silly, but I am only going on based on what I am used to. And I am used to the Bengals not winning when it matters. Sooooo many teams in the NFL have gotten hot for a season, and fallen down the next. Judging by how the Bengals have operated themselves in recent memory, what have they shown me to make me think they are not going to do it again?
Your team is good, very good. Really is not a glaring weakness anywhere, much like my Ravens. I just need to see if Cinci can in fact make this a trend, something that they have never shown me in the past.
Fair enough. My point though was just that everybody keeps saying that Bengals have improved and built a significantly better team this year, but I keep seeing us projected as 3rd in the AFC North. It doesn’t add up to me. If you want to argue that based on our tough schedule – Fine. If you want to argue that based on the declining numbers of Carson Palmer – fine. I just can’t wrap my head around the logic that history (particularly ancient history) is the predictor of success.
You’re right though. The only way to prove anybody wrong is to win.
This is our year!
by Paul Cannon on Jul 15, 2010 11:54 AM EDT up reply actions
My point though was just that everybody keeps saying that Bengals have improved and built a significantly better team this year, but I keep seeing us projected as 3rd in the AFC North.
Because the media and everyone else is sharing the same view point that I have. No disrespect to your team at all, but the Bengals are not known as an elite team such as the Ravens and Steelers are. Does that mean you guys can’t win it all next year? Hell no, your team is stacked with talent and you guys are definitely one of the few teams in the league right now who looks to be built for a Superbowl.
The Ravens and Steelers have always been the teams who are running the AFC North and representing the AFC North in the post season, so people outside of your fan base are going to continue to think that way based on the fact that we have won when it matters, and you guys have not (again, no disrespect).
Being the underdog is a great way to go through a 16 game season. You guys are most likely not the targeted team to beat like the Colts, Patriots, Chargers, Ravens and Steelers are. So go right ahead and show the world that doubting you guys was a bad decision, it should make for a great season for Cincinnati.
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