The Bengals get no respect...
by colley.kev on Aug 26, 2010 11:54 AM EDT
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Why are all the supposed Football Gurus saying our AFC North Champs Bengals are a middle of the road team? We have added nothing but good players this off-season and are returning most starters. They keep calling the Ravens a shoe-in for a playoff berth because they added Anquan Boldin? I don't buy it. I just hope this fuels the burners to mold our scrap steel defense, and fans the flames on our igniting offense. Go ahead boys, prove these a**holes wrong.
This is a FanPost and does not necessarily reflect the views of Cincy Jungle's writers or editors. It does reflect the views of this particular fan though, which is as important as the views of Cincy Jungle's writers or editors.
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I will let that slide since it is your site over here…
I great pickup, yes, but IMO just not as good of a pickup as Q… especially since we had a dearth of talent at that position and you already had Chad.
DOn’t know why that didn’t post correctly.
I think TO was a great pickup for you guys, but in my homer opinion I think it was slightly below signing for Q… especially considering what we had before Q was traded versus what you already had.
I think it's more complex than that
Honestly, Anquan may produce better for the Ravens than TO does for the Bengals. That is debatable for this season, though that is a long term deal that helps years down the road as well. But those 2 mves are only part of free agency. The Bengals picked up Pacman Jones (huge 3rd corner) Matt Jones (probably not making the team), Wilson (hurt in preseason) and Bryant (WTF?) while the Ravens grabbed Hamiln. Jones is the only one of those that will probably end up doing much this season for the Bengals, but I still think he brings more to the table than Hamlin does for the Ravens. However, if we call it a draw and move on…
I think what the media is focusing on is the potential for growth being greater in the players that the Ravens have. A lot of the Ravens playmakers are still trying to reach thier potential, while the Bengals seem to know what they have with thiers. But I’m not sure that that argument is as solid as it seems.
Discounting rookies, Flacco, Rice and Oher seem to be the big names on the Ravens who are expected to take on huge roles. I know Webb is expected to fill a much bigger role as well, and I’m sure there are others (right?). The Bengals have Smith (and the perception of who he is), Rivers, Maualuga and Micheal Johnson. Those guys don’t have near the notariety that the Ravens 2nd and 3rd year starters do.
If you throw in the Rookies, most people thought the Ravens had a great draft as well as the Bengals, but people probably gave the Ravens the edge due to recent draft history. As it turns out though, the Bengals rookies may have the ability to contribute more due to some unfortunate recent events.
Playoff success seems to play a big part in it as well. The team the Bengals finished the season with was certainly not the same one they played for most of the year with, especially on defense. That aside though, the Ravens have experienced some pretty deep post season runs of late. Lots of ananlysts think that teams follow the same pattern at the end of the previous season that they will in the following (which is so flipping stupid, saying that they carry the momentum of a 5 game win streak across the 6+ month off season). However, you can’t overlook the fact that the Ravens have been able to produce solidly at the time of year when all the chips are on the table.
Then there is the chemistry issue. I think the Bengals played thier cards right in signing TO to a one year contract. As an Eagles fan I am well versed with his antics, and he always makes a great impression his first year, then messes it all up soon after. I said the same thing when Buffalo grabbed him. Pacman seems to finally get it, like an alcoholic who has hit rock bottom gets it. He was almost out of the league and lost millions upon millions. He has a chance to get some of that back now, and I think he’s taking full advantage. There are others who have had problems in the past as well, but have shown no signs of trouble on the Bengals. It’s like the media was so fully expecting the experiment to blow up that they can’t get off that. Everything is running smoothly now, but they are still staring with baited breath and telling thier friends “Any minute now. This is gonna be awesome.” The one worry I would have about this is TO’s incentive laden contract. If he’s not getting the ball, that could spell trouble. I do think he will get it enough though, and that Chad can actually get through to him when he’s being a douche. But all that’s just conjecture.
Both of these teams are very good. I wouldn’t be surprised to see either in the Super Bowl. I am surprised however when I see preseason picks where Baltimore is the best by a good bit, then shitsburgh after all of the crap that they have been through this offseason (devestating injury, “forced” key trade, and a tough suspension along with so much negative attention) with the Bengals scrapping it out with the Browns for the bottom of the division. It almost seems like they are still so sure that the locker room will have a complete meltdown. I am not going to be one to bet much of anything on that.
It turns out I overestimated my apathy, but not enough to matter.
by einman77 on Aug 27, 2010 1:59 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
But TO doesn't have to outproduce Boldin
Boldin has to outproduce Chad.
Regardless, great read, good insight from someone well outside the AFC North that actually sides with both and sees them for what they are rather than reading in purple- or orange-tinted glasses.
For importance for your team, I’d agree that Q would be far more important. Because you’re right, before you got him, you had crap. And after he inevitably goes down to injury again, you will again. Seriously, the guy hasn’t played 16 games since the 2006 season, and all told has done it twice out of 7 years. Your odds of him surviving the year for you are not good.
The only reason Q might be a better pickup overall than TO is because TO is older and won’t stay with the team as long. Other than that, TO is more durable, and so long as his head stays in the game the better player as well.
ravens secondary is garbage, and they can't stop our running game
I’d rather get no respect than be overhyped…..*see Ravens
it comes down to mind over matter....if you don't mind, it won't matter
Benson looked good in the first game, but the second game he averaged about 3.2 YPC, that’s not unstoppable… that actually would define stoppable.
Our secondary is garbage though.
Stats in preseason are meaningless
M. Jones Drew averaged -.05 YPC in the second preseason game.
A. Peterson averaged 2.8 YPC in the second preseason game.
Shall I continue?
Who was talking about preseason?
Idiot, I’m talking about the games against the Ravens last year… first game against the Ravens was very good. like 25 carries for 110ish yards. Second game was not as statistcally good (though very good in fantasy) as he rushed for 120ish yards on about 35 carries.
Shall I continue? Douche.
Sorry if it was taken the wrong way by the way... meant the cock-knuckle and douche to be silly fun
It was on the topic of not being able to stop the run, which was the biggest reason we got swept… and Ray Lewis’ aversion to pass up an easy slobberknocker hit. I just assumed that logic would make it obvious that a preseason game’s stat line is not an indicator of future performance… so it didn’t even cross my mind.
child please
we are pretty sensible over there. Both of your FA pickups are not going to matter. They will both crumble and fail. TO is old and Q is a physical receiver prone to get hurt.
Healing from my new tattoos
Franco made that play because he never quit on the play. He kept running, he kept hustling. Good things happen to people who hustle."
lets talk regular season
Carson dominates you- check his career record vs the Ravens bro….I like to homer w/the best of them, but during Carson’s regime, he has basically owned you guys.
Benson….as for Benson, what was your streak of not allowing 100 yard rushers before he stomped it last year???? twice…..which isn’t a fool-proof argument, but it shows that you can’t stop our running game IMHHO
it comes down to mind over matter....if you don't mind, it won't matter
I’ve never argued that Carson hasn’t owned us, he finds hot reads well which is the type of QB that eats us up. No arguement. I just said Benson is not unstoppable. It was a long streak, and like I said the first game he was very good, but the second game he had pedestrian 3.2ish YPC. He only got 100 yards because he had well over 30 carries. Hell, you or I could get 100 yards if we had enough carries. By the way, in the Carson regime… we did sweep you two years ago, so don’t forget all history… overall, yes it has not been good for us.
everyone should have swept us 2 yrs ago, we won 4 games
doesn’t matter YPC over single games, single games are measured by the magical 100 yd mark. YPC over the course of a full season is a stat that does matter (4.2 ypc avg i think…)
I do have to give you props though ATX, it’s refreshing to talk AFCN w/a Ravens fan who behaves respectfully and doesn’t just try and cause trouble, again best of luck this year
it comes down to mind over matter....if you don't mind, it won't matter
Thanks, same to you, of course not during our two games...
Not going to lie though, I cause trouble on our blog when things go wrong, I just have the respect to try to not start it on your blog.. that would be steelerish of me. ;)
goes w/out saying during our two games
what you do on your blog is your concern, i don’t even post over there b/c it’s not worth trying to have an intelligent “discussion” w/out having a bunch of folks jump on your every word w/ ruthless homerism…but hey it is what it is
it comes down to mind over matter....if you don't mind, it won't matter
The Bengals versus Ravens Games
Will be great. First one sets the season tempo. Second one ends the season and possibly decides AFC North Champs. There’s no reason both teams shouldn’t sweep the Steelers and Browns.
2010 - The Year of the Tiger.
look at time of possession as well
bengals average over 41 minutes a game last year, highest in the league.
Yeah, it
"Before I write I let my mind go blind and let the Lord do His thing. " -Tupac Shakur
"Opportunity is missed by most people because it looks like work." -Thomas Edison
Man, my computer sucks sometimes.
Anyways, it’s refreshing to talk to someone who gives credit where credit is due and isn’t a Ravens homer.
"Before I write I let my mind go blind and let the Lord do His thing. " -Tupac Shakur
"Opportunity is missed by most people because it looks like work." -Thomas Edison
one-trick pony
yeah good to see the rantin raves finally realized our weakness that we had no deep threats once you double team (and mollywhop) chad. too bad once we throw it around and shove ced down your throats, you wont know what to do :D
OH Yeah! Duffman's pelvis is thrusting in the direction of the problem!
Yeh, I don't get the "Ravens are serious playoff contenders" jazz
Palmer > Flacco
Chad, Antonio, and Terrell > Boldin, Mason, and Stallworth
Gresham, Kelly, and Coffman > Heap and the other two Rookies
Bengals Defense > Ravens Defense
Apparently all NFL analysts failed math or something.
Just going off of history. You are built better to beat us and the AFCN and we are built better to beat the rest of the NFL. That’s why you have our number the past several years but we have a better record against the rest of the NFL.
serious playoff contenders means that we will contend to make the playoffs… so that is legit. All the super hype for SB favorites is excessive, but playoffs is logical. I think it will be a three team race between the Steelers, Bengals, and Ravens to take two slots in the playoffs. Cinncy and Bmore have the edge since the rapist is out a few games, so IMO I see the Bengals and Ravens make the playoffs. There is no reason we can’t both make it.
My point cock-knuckle
was that I am not buying into the Ravens-hype the way most Ravens fans are and still think AFCN is in no way locked up for the Ravens the way many analysts and fans appear to.
Sorry. It's Jason Ellis rubbing off on me.
Radio show host on Sirius Sat Radio…
AFC North
Best division in the NFL. Be a slobberknocker every week.
Blogger at CincyJungle.com -- SB Nation Cincinnati Bengals blog.
by Josh Kirkendall on Aug 26, 2010 1:24 PM EDT up reply actions
Good to see we can agree on some things..
like Ruthlesbathroomstall. :D
but chyeah here’s hoping to a Bmore-Cincy game in the wild card! It would be a pretty epic matchup i like what each team is doing. superbowl hype for either at this point is pye in teh sky. good luck!
OH Yeah! Duffman's pelvis is thrusting in the direction of the problem!
I like you
You’re sensible and are willing to take the purple-colored shades for the sake of sensible argument.
But you’re right, I see at least two teams from the AFCN pushing each other into it. Your secondary issues had me thinking that the Steelers would get the jump on you guys, Big Ben or no, and would eventually push you out of second place, but it seems the secondary is coming back together again for your team. This is why it’s going to be so close in the AFC in general this year. Unlike last year’s 6-team wild card race, I expect it to be a huge battle between the top two seeds in the East and North and a battle with the Texans and the hopeful Raiders just attempting to make it.
Should make for an interesting year.
I'm fine with it anymore
If people are picking the Ravens to win it, I’m fine with that. Preseason projections tend to be more meaningless than preseason college football polls. All that matters is how we play each other. And I really think these games between the Bengals and Ravens will be game of the week type of battles.
I’m just going NUTS waiting for this season to kickoff. That’s all.
Blogger at CincyJungle.com -- SB Nation Cincinnati Bengals blog.
by Josh Kirkendall on Aug 26, 2010 1:24 PM EDT reply actions
good point about how we are built differently....BUT
first and foremost you have to take care of business in your division, would you agree?
Furthermore, i guess i don’t agree w/you being built to handle “the rest of the NFL” i attribute your postseason success vs ours to one BIG FACTOR, and that is coaching! I like Marvin, I LOVE ZIMMER, all our position coaches are good as well, but the glaring difference is at OC. Bratkowski is hands down the most predictable, un-creative OC in the league…..week in and week out he has 1 game plan ready (which is to play to our strengths…mainly by hammering the running game) which is fine by me, BUT in this league you need to be capable of two things as on OC.
1. Create unique and challenging gameplans that not only play to your strenghts, but expose your opponents weak spots (Which Brat does NOT do).
2. Make Half Time adjustments to afformentioned gameplan and execute during the second half (also something that Brat DOES NOT DO)
You’re play calling is atleast creative and not obvious…should be a good year in the AFC N, good luck bro
it comes down to mind over matter....if you don't mind, it won't matter
back to hurry up offense
or let palmer make the calls… he did awesome in 2005, lets go back to that, had defenses f-ed up.
BENGALS AND RAVENS
I agree with you it will come down to these two teams in the north, But i really believe the Bengals will go 5-1 in the division the only lose coming in Baltimore. they will game of the week battles like you said josh.
by bensonwarriors on Aug 27, 2010 10:26 AM EDT up reply actions
Wow congrats on your team gettin 2 wins last years
but its not going to happen again.
Healing from my new tattoos
Franco made that play because he never quit on the play. He kept running, he kept hustling. Good things happen to people who hustle."
Perspective from an outsider...
I respect the Bengals, and know what you guys are capable of. The thing is, you guys don’t get the national respect/spotlight b/c you haven’t been consistent.
When was the last time the Bengals had back to back winning seasons?
When was the last playoff victory?
What was the last defining franchise moment?
Steelers/Ravens each have multiple playoff appearances, AFC title game appearances, and each have won a Lombardi Trophy over the last 10 seasons. Talking heads pick the Ravens b/c they are currently the “safe” pick in the division. Whether or not the season shakes out that way remains to be seen.
And you have every right to do so...
…but that’s not the point of the post.
You wonder why the Bengals don’t get national respect, and that’s why. They haven’t quite earned it…yet (but they likely will in the next few seasons).
I’m not a blind Ravens fanboy. I respect the orange-and-black, and think they’ve got an excellent shot at the division this year. I agree that the media (and Baltimore fans) have slightly overrated our potential.
Should be an excellent 3 way battle for the crown this year.
+1
I can understand it. It’s because we slumped at the end of the season. The Ravens simply played better at the end.
And although we swept the AFCN but we didn’t really dominate the play. Several come from behind games could have gone either way. It took to the end of overtime and a ‘clutch’ Graham barely-clearing-the-post field goal just to beat Cleveland.
So basically they think we were lucky last year and still need to prove ourselves.
by IllinoisBengal on Aug 26, 2010 7:03 PM EDT up reply actions
I agree.
People act like we dominated the AFC North last year. Think about this; if Ray Lewis hadn’t hit Ocho and been flagged on that play, we could have been looking at a different result there. What if Caldwell had happened to drop one of his big catches? What if Leonard’s dive on the 4th down hadn’t worked?
The division will not be easy to win.
"Before I write I let my mind go blind and let the Lord do His thing. " -Tupac Shakur
"Opportunity is missed by most people because it looks like work." -Thomas Edison
agree
The Bengals didnt finish the season or dominate really anyone, and for some reason they always play down to their level of competition. Theres no way the raiders should have been able to hang to the point where Caldwells fumble lost it. The Bengals have to show they can win consistantly and not just have a good year once every 5 years. Hopefully this is the year and im very confident it will be. WHO DEY
Off topic
http://www.nationalfootballpost.com/How-an-agent-can-define-a-career.html
Check that article out guys, pretty interesting read about Raven DT Kelly Gregg involving the Bengals.
Couple of pieces I like.
When 6th round pick DT Kelly Gregg was cut by the Bengals in 1999, they signed him to the practice squad. The personnel director emphahttp://www.cincyjungle.com/2010/8/26/1651948/the-bengals-get-no-respect#tically told me, "Kelly will never play in the League, and he is lucky to have a practice roster spot."
To the Eagles’ surprise, I moved Kelly to the Ravens the next day. Rex kept his promise, and Kelly went on to be the NFL leader in tackles for all defensive lineman over the next 10 years of his career.
yeah, the bengals of the ‘90s made a lot of stupid personnel moves; that’s why they sucked.
i'm going to go america all over your ass!
Ravens
My thing is this. The media is not giving us any shot at winning the division again. I did here K.Johnson say he thought the Bengals would repeat but he is the only one i heard that from. The Ravens secondary is without Foxworth all season after he went on IR because of his knee injury last year and the other corner is also coming off a knee injury. Ed Reed may not play till week seven if he goes on PUP list so where does that leave there secondary. They were given a high grade in the draft by taking S.Kindle and T.Cody with there first two picks and Kindle had some major injury concerns coming in and Cody had his problem with his weight. Yet the media raved about this draft. If the Bengals had drafted either of these guys we would have been crusified. Since the draft Kindle has fractured his skull and Cody has been unable to get in shape to pass his physical so he could practice. So the only positive thing the Ravens did was pick up A.Boldin and I don’t know how good a pick up Stallworth is, he has speed and can get downfield but his hands are questionable. The Ravens could not pass the ball downfield aginst us in either game last year consistantly. They were able to run the ball on us at times but again not consistantly and Flacco had to dump passes off underneath to the RB’s and TE’s. They do not match up well with us and I don’t see them winning the division over us this year. But every game in the AFC North is a tough game so none of these games will be easy no matter the other teams record coming in. We also have almost the same schedule with the Saints and Colts being added to ours.
q is better than t.o and bryant
but q is not better than t.o bryant combined plus we got the best wr in the nfl on the other side of t.o with the best qb in the nfl throwing to t.o bryant OCHO shiply cladwell gresham and what do the ravens have they have a man with a catapiller across his forhead at qb a 90 yr old wr and q and there should be no question which off is better and our d isent far behind who dey nation better be ready for a huge season!!!!
what do the ravens have they have a man with a catapiller across his forhead
That man just so happens to have more playoff victories than your boy. Flattering…
its always sunny
he kinda looks like one of "the gangs’ " nemesis’ on It’s always Sunny in Philadelphia
it comes down to mind over matter....if you don't mind, it won't matter
He was the Quarterback (the most important player on a team) of a team that won 3 playoff games in 2 seasons.
He was doing something right…..
I guess I can agree that a QB who wins playoff games is elevated to a new status.
But if you look at Palmer, just look at how talented he is. He has a really good arm.
But the thing about the Ravens (or even the Bengals) winning a playoff game is that it will be more about Ray Rice (or Ced) and the defense. I think there are a lot of QB’s you could have thrown in Flacco’s spot to get the job done.
Now let’s think about ‘05 Palmer. That team ran around the pass game and was damn good. Bengals fans think [hope] that he can get back to that form. If he can do that he’s one of the elite QB’s in the NFL.
"Before I write I let my mind go blind and let the Lord do His thing. " -Tupac Shakur
"Opportunity is missed by most people because it looks like work." -Thomas Edison
But if you look at Palmer, just look at how talented he is. He has a really good arm.
I know this. He is very talented. Palmer is like a poor man’s Dan Marino. I say that because Marino never won a Superbowl but was damn good, and Palmer has never won a playoff game, but is damn good. The injuries probably have contributed to some things I am sure.
I think there are a lot of QB’s you could have thrown in Flacco’s spot to get the job done.
Gonna have to disagree with you here and I think that is a little unfair to say that. Joe has done something only done once before in Ravens history and that was go to the playoffs and win games in 2 straight years.
Has Joe been a reason we have not advanced to a Superbowl in the last two seasons? Yea, he might have been. But he has also been a reason we have gotten as close as we have. That is all I am saying.
i’m not saying anything against flacco; i just hate it when people use postseason victories as evidence of a quarterback’s greatness (see steelers fans), when it’s just as much to do with the team and coaching around the quarterback. a bad quarterback performance could cost the team the game (like kitna in 2005; or carson’s egg-laying against the jets, although that was a team effort to allow the jets to just roll over us), but i really think the days of a quarterback actually being the reason a team wins are long gone.
i'm going to go america all over your ass!
by Raging Clue on Aug 28, 2010 10:35 AM EDT up reply actions
and considering the team you’re a fan of, i think you’d agree quarterback isn’t necessarily as important a position as it’s made out to be in the media. trent dilfer was paid not to lose.
i'm going to go america all over your ass!
by Raging Clue on Aug 28, 2010 10:38 AM EDT up reply actions
I do think Quarterback is the most important position and I have always thought that. If you think differently, I am not sure why you would think that. What would hurt the Ravens more, losing Ray Lewis for a season (who I am sure you think is our most important player) or Joe Flacco for the season? I would say losing Joe for a season could be the biggest blow to us, hence he is our most important player.
Ray Lewis isn't the most important player.
What I’m saying is that it would hurt the Ravens most to lose Ray Rice for the season. They’re a running football team.
"Before I write I let my mind go blind and let the Lord do His thing. " -Tupac Shakur
"Opportunity is missed by most people because it looks like work." -Thomas Edison
I kinda disagree with you
As much as I hate to say it, given the Steelers’ fourth quarter defensive relapses, Ben played a big role in any of their success last season. I don’t credit his 2005 Super Bowl championship as any of his merits, but he’s stepped up when his team needed him to do so.
i just hate it when people use postseason victories as evidence of a quarterback’s greatness
Why? I just don’t get why a QB has to put up great numbers in order to get credit for a win. Would you rather Carson put up 250, 3 tds and an int in a loss or 110 and no turnovers in a win? Just saying that the guy who touches the ball on every snap is doing something right if we are winning in the postseason.
Team game
I don’t believe Flacco is a great quarterback and I’m really tired of people labeling him as one until he actually has impact in his games. Had Palmer been a Raven, I have no doubt in my mind he would’ve had a much more successful career than here in Cincinnati.
I don’t believe Flacco is a great quarterback and I’m really tired of people labeling him as one until he actually has impact in his games.
He may not be a great QB yet, but you cannot deny that Flacco has done a great job in his first two years. There is a reason he has done things in his first two years that no other QB has ever done. He is on the right track to being a great QB, and that is seen by his progression from his rookie yea to his 2nd year. I don’t think it is a reach to say he will pass for 4,000+ this year, which to me is a great year for a QB.
Had Palmer been a Raven, I have no doubt in my mind he would’ve had a much more successful career than here in Cincinnati.
Maybe, but it is quite dumb to say something like this because it never happened and never will. Palmer is a great QB and as a Bengals fan, I am not sure you should be making statements like that.
It’s not a reach but it has to become a reality if the Ravens want to reach the Super Bowl.
Maybe, but it is quite dumb to say something like this because it never happened and never will. Palmer is a great QB and as a Bengals fan, I am not sure you should be making statements like that.You’re right, it won’t happen, just kind of an “what if” scenario that I made mostly for the sake of strengthening my own argument.
by Doc Scratch on Aug 29, 2010 12:42 AM EDT up reply actions
Most important player, maybe
But looking at the stats, how much of any of his playoff wins relied on his arm? His stats against New England last year were just atrocious and his stats a year earlier weren’t significantly better either.
Your team is good, I can admit to that, but people saying Flacco is better than Palmer because the Ravens have won playoff games just makes my blood boil.
Sometimes it’s not about what you do, but what you don’t do. Joe did just enough to get the win and that is all I can ask for.
And just by me saying that he is a playoff winning QB, I am not saying he is better than Carson. BUT, you have to admit that he has done some great things that Carson has not and is on the right track of becoming an elite QB.
He's not there yet
People should stop labeling him as such.
Honestly, Carson has had the opportunity to do good things but his team seems to have always held him down, other than ‘05 and I guess he was partly responsible for ’09’s Wild Card loss, though I still think had Cosby played, games would’ve turned out differently.
’06, injuries/indictments, ’07 everything is on a downhill, ’08 FO takes away his decent OLine and replaced it with two turnstiles at center and guard that still have yet to be fixed that eventually causes him to take too much of a beating and get injured (throwing like a madman to make up for the poor defense probably added to it).
Thus, I think Palmer is the reason that the Bengals have had what mild success they have had and that Flacco isn’t elite because he has had little impact on any success the Ravens have had.
Flacco isn’t elite because he has had little impact on any success the Ravens have had.
Not to be rude to everyone on this blog, but this is one of the most idiotic and rude statements I have ever heard. Do you honestly think that the Ravens would have been a playoff winning team the last two seasons with Troy Smith as the QB? Hell no.
Get a grip dude and stop trying to make Joe out to be a bust, because he is far from it. Joe has had a MAJOR impact on why this team has been as successful as they have been.
Not saying he's a bust
Just not believing all the hype he’s getting this year. I don’t buy into the Sanchez hype either, one postseason miracle does not an elite quarterback make.
So let him prove me wrong. If he does it, cool shoes, I’ll sit there in awe as he matures into what the Ravens drafted him to be. But until he’s done it, I’m going to assume he’s average.
by Doc Scratch on Aug 29, 2010 12:45 AM EDT up reply actions
Though I should probably add
He’s doing well in the preseason thus far. As things stands, he’s well on his way to proving me wrong.
by Doc Scratch on Aug 29, 2010 12:54 AM EDT up reply actions
Not sure why you thought this way of him to begin with. I understand that any QB drafted has their doubts, but guys like Flacco, Ryan, Sanchez and the others drafted in the first over the last few years are indeed the future of this league. I am sure people were saying the same thing about Peyton, Rivers, Eli and Ben when they were all drafted and look at what they have done.
For every good first round pick
There has also been at least one average to bad to bust QB to go along with it. Each Peyton, Eli, Rivers, and Roethlisberger have been met with an Akili, Leaf, Russell, and Leinart.
I’m not saying Flacco can’t be good down the line, but thus far, he hasn’t proven it. I’m not going to crown him before he’s proved he deserves it.
I’m not saying Flacco can’t be good down the line, but thus far, he hasn’t proven it.
I would really like to know why you think this. 62% completion, 6,500+ yards and 35 TD’s for a 84.9 rating in your first 2 seasons along with 3 playoff wins is every indication of him becoming one of the league’s best.
Joe has yet to put up a season like Akili, Leaf, Russel and Leinart have, and you know it is dumb to put them in the same conversation as Flacco. His first two seasons are very comparable to those of Peyton, Eli, Rivers and Ben, so what makes you think he will not have the same impact for the Ravens as those guys have had for their teams. I think you just don’t want to admit he is a good QB.
Isn't that what I've been saying all along?
I don’t see it yet. While I’ve never looked at his numbers and they do help his case, my entire point was that I simply just don’t believe he’s a good quarterback and will not label him one thus far.
one postseason miracle does not an elite quarterback make.
So what does that mean for Joe since he has won in the playoffs in two straight years?
I wouldn't credit anything on Flacco for last postseason
Their biggest reason they couldn’t go farther than they did was because their offense became too focused on Ray Rice. Flacco couldn’t complete a pass and Indy game planned for this.
LIkewise, Indy’s biggest issue was it was just as one-dimensional. Peyton rarely uses his backs, he likes to throw so much more often. He doesn’t even utilize the backs in the passing game, which would help him out a lot. Therefore, the Saints’ deep secondary could focus more on this, eventually resulting in the game-deciding pick-six.
I’d blame Flacco more for their postseason errors than his success in light of this. Of course, I could be wrong. If I am, can you show me where?
I’d blame Flacco more for their postseason errors than his success in light of this.
I do to, but I also give him credit for getting us there. Like I have said before, he was the QB for a team that has been there late in January. If he wants to throw 5 interceptions and we still win the Superbowl, well you did a damn good job Joe.
Here's my main point...
The Ravens are a run-first team and have been since Flacco has been there. Yeah, he’s shown that he’s GOOD by stepping up when he needs to pass. But his biggest job over these past two years has been handing the ball to Ray Rice, who is probably a top five RB in the league. That’s also why at the moment, I don’t think Carson should be considered elite either.
The difference is, Palmer has taken a gunslinging team and taken them to the playoffs (and could have been in the playoffs in ’06, if not for Graham.)
When it comes down to it Flacco is on a run-first team so I don’t think it’s fair to compare him to guys like Brady, Manning, Brees, or even someone like Matt Schaub.
"Before I write I let my mind go blind and let the Lord do His thing. " -Tupac Shakur
"Opportunity is missed by most people because it looks like work." -Thomas Edison
bengals are a run first team now too...
and carson has taken a gunslinging team and a running team to the playoffs… flacco hasn’t. palmer is more well rounded.
You show me where I ever compared him with Brady or Brees. And Schaub, really? Another QB who has yet TO EVEN MAKE IT TO THE PLAYOFFS.
The difference is, Palmer has taken a gunslinging team and taken them to the playoffs (and could have been in the playoffs in ’06, if not for Graham.)
Well guess what, he has never won in the playoffs. Joe has. Flacco has passed for the 5th most yards in league history in his first 2 seasons. Joe is the only QB in NFL history to win 2 road playoff games in his rookie year. I never said Joe was great, but he is damn good and on his way to becoming great. Joe WILL have a better career than your boy Carson and honestly, he might already have.
Here's where you compared him to Manning
His first two seasons are very comparable to those of Peyton, Eli, Rivers and Ben,
Just because you didn’t mention Brees in Brady doesn’t mean you didn’t make the comparison. You’re trying to put Flacco into elite company, company Brady and Brees both belong in.
Owned.
"Before I write I let my mind go blind and let the Lord do His thing. " -Tupac Shakur
"Opportunity is missed by most people because it looks like work." -Thomas Edison
Also
Matt Schaub passed for more yards than Manning and Brees last season. He definitely is a good quarterback, even if he hasn’t won a playoff game yet.
My mother...
could have passed for that many yards with thats receiving core. Please…
I don't know shit about baseball.
that receiving corps? you mean andre johnson?
i'm going to go america all over your ass!
by Raging Clue on Aug 30, 2010 11:04 AM EDT up reply actions
it’s a decent to good group, but not one that makes anybody a 4700-yard passer.
i'm going to go america all over your ass!
by Raging Clue on Aug 30, 2010 12:31 PM EDT up reply actions
i would say it’s more a good system fit for the quarterback than it is the greatness of his receivers.
i'm going to go america all over your ass!
Put Flacco on the Texans and he doesn't throw for 4700 yards.
Flacco hasn’t shown that he can run a pass-first offense. CP has. So has Matt Schaub.
"Before I write I let my mind go blind and let the Lord do His thing. " -Tupac Shakur
"Opportunity is missed by most people because it looks like work." -Thomas Edison
This is just an ignorant thing to say.
I’m not even going to waste my time responding.
You tried to seem polite and likable at first but it was inevitable that eventually you’d resort to your nonsensical, ignorant, childish trash talk.
"Before I write I let my mind go blind and let the Lord do His thing. " -Tupac Shakur
"Opportunity is missed by most people because it looks like work." -Thomas Edison
Thanks Mr MaLor
A lot of opposing fans do not think so and we don’t get any respect like you just gave.
You don’t get any respect because your team has not one a playoff game in so long. That is not me talking smack, that is just the truth of why the media and other fans looks at you the way you do.
I am not sure I would say you aren’t getting respect, you guys swept a division that has two of the top 5 organizations in it last year. I would just say that people aren’t taking you seriously, which I am sure you will say is a big mistake to do. I would agree.
The Bengals are loaded, there is no hiding it. But what I have noticed in the NFL is that just because you have the best talent does not mean you have the best team. Bengals got the talent, we just gotta see if they are a TEAM that puts it together.
The team can put it together really well on defense.
You’ll probably think I’m just jocking Zimmer, but that dude can really get them to play together. It’s crazy how much impact he has. “Gang-tackling” was pretty rare on this team before he came along and made them gang-tackle.
No one really knows about the offense yet, though.
"Before I write I let my mind go blind and let the Lord do His thing. " -Tupac Shakur
"Opportunity is missed by most people because it looks like work." -Thomas Edison
Zimmer is a great coach. I have come to strongly notice that over the last year. You guys have a great 4-3 defense and it is tough to be as good as you guys were in a 4-3 defense. Secondary is solid, could be better with better safeties. LB is fast and powerful. D-Line has some great talent with Odom and that chia-pet looking guy, Peko? Alot of promise as well with Michael Johnson and Dunlap who could be great edge rushers.
LOL
He does sort of look like a chia pet. His name is Domata Peko. He’s a monster run stopper.
"Before I write I let my mind go blind and let the Lord do His thing. " -Tupac Shakur
"Opportunity is missed by most people because it looks like work." -Thomas Edison
TEAM is the reason why these so called "head case" players haven't been head cases since coming here
Everyone here realizes that the team is more important than themselves. They’re not holding out or making threats for their own personal gain, they’re all playing for what they love and all competing for something that no other Bengals team has had the opportunity of claiming: a Super Bowl title. Individual talent is there, yes, but the Bengals of ’09 did not reach that level simply through a group of individuals. Likewise, the ’10 Bengals will not reach the Super Bowl unless they play as a team.
Win or lose, they do it as a team.
That's the great thing about picking up guys who have been troubled in the past who no one else wants.
A lot of them have great talent and the fact that they were given a second chance gives them a strong sense of loyalty towards the team that helped them get back into the game.
For a lot of guys, that team happens to be the Bengals.
"Before I write I let my mind go blind and let the Lord do His thing. " -Tupac Shakur
"Opportunity is missed by most people because it looks like work." -Thomas Edison
Hence why I love this team
Probably the one thing that keeps me coming back and will always keep me coming back. We may hate some of the moves Mikey makes but that cheapskate mentality has built a group of guys with one of the strongest sense of teamwork in the league.
by Doc Scratch on Aug 29, 2010 12:46 AM EDT up reply actions
This is what you've gotta acknowledge, no matter who you're a fan of.
Just like I understand fully that the Ravens are a good team that will cause us trouble.
Should be a good battle for the division. People say it’s a 3-team race but I feel like the Steelers are a bit behind the Bengals and Ravens. They still have an outside shot, though.
"Before I write I let my mind go blind and let the Lord do His thing. " -Tupac Shakur
"Opportunity is missed by most people because it looks like work." -Thomas Edison
the steelers are a tough read this season; all evidence points to their downfall, but it’s the steelers.
i'm going to go america all over your ass!
by Raging Clue on Aug 28, 2010 10:36 AM EDT up reply actions
+1
So true. You really can’t ever count them out. However, there are many signs pointing in there favor.
This is our year!
by Paul Cannon on Aug 28, 2010 12:08 PM EDT up reply actions
Their Oline still sucks though.
If they can get better on the Oline then I say there is a three way battle for the AFCN title. We’ll see though, with Big Benover out for at least 4 games…
So true
I’ve tried to discredit them. It doesn’t work. That defense has gotten better since last year. Sure, the offense has taken one two five steps back, but the defense was the biggest reason they didn’t make the playoffs last year. They’re still in it.
They will be a tough team as usual, but Ravens and Bengals are just setup better to make a run right now. Pitt has too many negatives going on with them.
damn computer..
But it seems that they are always right there to contend even with so many negatives. So you can’t count them out. (See last year, till the end)
I just find it funny
that the only things that Lamestream media focuses on are….
1) TO + Ocho chemistry
2) Palmer
3) Same ol’ Bengals
WHEN WILL PEOPLE LOOK AT THE DEFENSE! FOR GOD SAKES THEY WERE THE 4th BEST IN THE LEAGUE LAST YEAR!!
Listening to all these football analysts and I swear they read the media reports from 2004 and make an opinion. They dont do any REAL analysis.
The only people I have heard that give us SOME respect and a chance to do some things this year are John Clayton, Mike Lombardi, and some other guy from SI.
King, Simmons, Football Outsiders, and most of the ESPN staff just regurgitate the same crap that some guy said 15 minutes before he did. Im not saying the Bengals should be superbowl favorites, but we are fielding a very solid team this year
Hi fans it Brandon Roy.
And ME.....LaMarcus Aldridge
I heard Merrill Hodge (ESPN) give us some respect too.
He actually went against everybody that picked the Ratbirds and Stoolers to be the 2 top teams in the AFCN. He said he really thinks our Defense is better than the others.
And he’s a X-Stooler.
How long were the first stringers in the game for?
Did Palmer only play 3 series? did the first string D come out before halftime?
Hi fans it Brandon Roy.
And ME.....LaMarcus Aldridge
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