Bengals Could Look In-House Rather Than The Draft For Safety Development
The NFL Draft. It's the time of year fans feel empowered, slotting players into needs for their favorite team while some just like the challenge of predicting the first rounds. Though it's premature to make predictions on what positions the Bengals will draft -- free agency hasn't happened yet and players could still be franchised or signed with their respective teams -- it's still fun as hell to debate the uncertainty that's still four months away.
As for the Bengals, our early projections for team needs isn't a short list. At least one guard, perhaps several (depending on the team re-signing one of their own, namely Bobbie Williams), is an absolute necessity. Perhaps the team could sign a guard in free agency, or perhaps someone like David DeCastro will fall to them at 17 or 21. Yet one area that could be identified as a need, but might not be addressed as such, is safety.
If Cincinnati re-signs Reggie Nelson, who is entering free agency as an unrestricted free agent, it still leaves one starting safety position up for grabs with the presumption that Chris Crocker's role will be reduced from starter to "utility guy" in the secondary. Will Cincinnati look to the draft for a safety?
"I think we’ll have the most intense competition at the safety spot that we’ve probably had," (Bengals defensive backs coach Kevin) Coyle said Wednesday. "Along with the guys we hopefully bring back, this group will have the most competition that we’ve ever had in terms of players being on the cusp of challenging to be starting players. These guys are at the point now where they legitimately have the opportunity to go out there and prove themselves."
The players Coyle keeps referencing are the younger guys Cincinnati acquired last year in Taylor Mays and Robert Sands, along with cornerback Brandon Ghee possibly having a greater role in next year's defense.
Defensive backs coach Kevin Coyle argued that along with their big size, they run well and once they get the mental aspect down, they could reach a high level.
"They’ve got to be very technique sound and conscious because it’s not easy for a big man to change direction in space. They’ve got to be conscious of playing low, bending their knees, and being able to anticipate the game to make plays. I think they’re capable. I’ve seen them do it numerous times on the practice field."
Taylor Mays, a former second-round draft pick for San Francisco, will enter his first offseason with the Bengals after a season in which he dealt with several nagging injuries.
Said Coyle of Mays: "He has some unique physical qualities which puts him in a rare category. The one aspect of playing the position though is to become an effective safety it doesn't require size and speed. There's a football intellect and savvy that the great players have have. All these guys have the physical skills that once it comes together they'll be effective."
Does that mean the Bengals won't address safety in the NFL Draft? No. They still need work developing the team's depth and if a player like Alabama's Mark Barron, listed as the draft's best prospect at safety according to Scout Inc. and 14th overall, is available, the team has to consider it. After that the talent level at safety declines, with Notre Dame's Harrison Smith, Oklahoma State's Markelle Martin, USC's T.J. McDonald and Michigan State's Trent Robinson rounding out the top five positional rankings according to Scout Inc.
Regardless if the draft doesn't offer solutions at safety, the team may already have one in the works, developing the younger players acquired last year.
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ignoring fa safety signing

"the bengals are not a west of the 104 longitude team."
by palewook on Jan 12, 2012 11:34 AM EST reply actions 1 recs
yeah
we have to do SOMETHING….This has been a weakness of ours for a LONG time
"In a battle between patience and power, patience always wins"
by ticalcaldwell on Jan 12, 2012 11:42 AM EST up reply actions
yeah but we have mays and the best 2 DB coaches in the league
hopefully they can make something of him..
Zimmer you need to stay.
by Bengalsfan024 on Jan 12, 2012 12:04 PM EST up reply actions
Draft Barron!
I think it’s time we started getting playmakers in the secondary. Look at the really good defensives and how they can use DBs to blitz and alter offenses. The draft seems to be the best route here since I don’t see anyone better than Reggie Nelson available on the street.
FYI – T.J. McDonald is a junior and announced he’s returning to school.
as long as we resign Nelson
I wouldn’t mind having Mays and Sands play next year. I wouldn’t pass up Barron if he’s the best player available, but I wouldn’t reach for someone else either. Have to resign Nelson to have atleast one saftey we can for sure count on though.
by JCompton41 on Jan 12, 2012 11:37 AM EST via mobile reply actions
I just dont know on the safety position
Sands= (was this guy even on our roster)?
Mays = (just have the Madden hit-stick miss image against the Rams TD catch)
Crocker = watch playoff game……nuff said
Nelson = keep em….we need this guy
Gibril Wilson = who?
Jeromey Miles = special teams guy…never seen him make a single play outside of spec teams
None of these guys convince me that we are good to go………FA or DRAFT…..have to get at least one guy that can start if need be……..
"In a battle between patience and power, patience always wins"
I will add to this
We did have a chance at the playoffs all year long so I understand that it probably wasnt a good time to develop guys during actual games….you stick with the guys who have gotten you there…..but that play against foster just sticks in my head….Crocker just escorted him into the endzone…..lol..unreal
"In a battle between patience and power, patience always wins"
by ticalcaldwell on Jan 12, 2012 11:41 AM EST up reply actions
Crocker has to go!
I can’t watch him out there any longer. On that play my twelve year old son even asked why in the world he was so far away and not giving Pacman any help!! I told my son it’s because he could play NFL safety better than Crocker, hands down, lol.
yeah
Crock left Jones out to dry in the Cardinals game too…the Fitz play toward the end…..yeah…it is time to go
"In a battle between patience and power, patience always wins"
by ticalcaldwell on Jan 12, 2012 12:01 PM EST up reply actions
Mays hits hard and was able to cover owen daniels quiet nicely
in the first texans game (was inactive for the second)
by Bengalsfan024 on Jan 12, 2012 12:05 PM EST up reply actions
the old Owen Daniels / Mays correlation
yeah…but Daniels had over a 100 yards that game…Daniels wasnt covered that well…
"In a battle between patience and power, patience always wins"
by ticalcaldwell on Jan 12, 2012 12:06 PM EST up reply actions
While others were covering him
Mays didn’t cover him till late.
by Oregonbengalsfan on Jan 12, 2012 1:05 PM EST up reply actions
I know what he was saying
My overall point is that Mays is raw..Just like Coyle said, there will be great competition in camp for the safety position…I like Mays speed and body type…
"In a battle between patience and power, patience always wins"
by ticalcaldwell on Jan 12, 2012 1:08 PM EST up reply actions
Man if we could of gotten Whitner.....man that would of helped
woulda, coulda, …………..I know
"In a battle between patience and power, patience always wins"
by ticalcaldwell on Jan 12, 2012 11:38 AM EST up reply actions
the cost of franchising a safety in the nfl
is cheap compared to other defensive positions. great safeties rarely hit the free agent market, instead you get 2nd tier guys like wilson.
"the bengals are not a west of the 104 longitude team."
+1
I am still hoping we also bring in a good vet in FA to maybe help with our Safety draft pick….whodey
"In a battle between patience and power, patience always wins"
by ticalcaldwell on Jan 12, 2012 11:53 AM EST up reply actions
My Call
is that we go with Trumaine Johnson, the kid played some SS and he also played CB if Mays and Sands dont pan out Johnson can step right in to help take over, but if Sand or Mays both step up, we can move Johnson to CB
probly the best option
not so much the guy you name but grabbing someone that could do both.
Hall and clement can hold down the CB spots next year if we upgrade the Safteys. so having a tweener type or moving crocker to that tweener type role would help
by Bengalsfan024 on Jan 12, 2012 12:07 PM EST up reply actions
can also move Clements to safety
Provided we add depth at corner in the draft and get production out of ghee
The Curse of Bo Jackson: Jan 13th,1991- present day
by TruWhoDey on Jan 13, 2012 12:19 AM EST via iPhone app up reply actions
CB's can move to safety and OT's can move to OG and have good success
So if we get some extra CB’s, we can fill in our Safety need that way.
But the problem is we don’t have a lot of CB’s returning under contract
Clements could go to safety as I mentioned above
Or even pacman- he is a little undersized,but he has recovery-speed,isn’t afraid to drop the hammer is probably the best ballhawk in our secondary…just need to fill that 3rd corner role if Pac moves to safety…I think ghee could be that 3rd or even mays in certain packages
The Curse of Bo Jackson: Jan 13th,1991- present day
by TruWhoDey on Jan 13, 2012 12:22 AM EST via iPhone app up reply actions
We should move leon hall to free safety
I don’t think he ever had great corner speed now he’s really not going to have good speed but he’s a good tackler. We could move reggie nelson too strong safety and draft a corner.
by Hoke Hogan on Jan 12, 2012 12:07 PM EST via mobile reply actions
This all sounds like
The Jason Shirley experiment. Core competencies should not be overlooked. Switching player positions isn’t an option for the Bengals.
by sgiridharan1982 on Jan 12, 2012 1:01 PM EST up reply actions
I actually think this might work
but it wont happen….If Hall keeps getting beat like he did this year….I dont know….might be worth trying…Hall just doesnt have the speed and jumping ability that is needed at this position….we’ll see when he comes back off of injury how he performs
"In a battle between patience and power, patience always wins"
by ticalcaldwell on Jan 12, 2012 12:11 PM EST up reply actions
Coach Speak
I take what any coach says with a grain of salt. Sometimes they say stuff to try to light a fire under guys to give them hope they may contend for a starting job next season if they work hard during the offseason.
Sometimes it is a smoke screen to make other teams think you are not interested in drafting a safety.
Or maybe Coyle really believes what he said.
I know I am not real comfortable going into next year with a combination of Mays, Sands and Miles competing for a starting job at safety.
BTW – when I was reading this article on bengals.com it struck me what Coyle said about Sands having great hands. The kid is 6’4 209 lbs with very good speed and great hands. If he doesn’t work out at safety, then I think it would definitely be worth a shot developing him as a wide receiver.
I really hope Mays and/or Sands pan out
If not, I actually like the idea of transitioning a CB into safety, especially since the NFL has really been turned into a passing League.
Drafting Trumain Johnson has been mentioned, you also have Clements and/or Hall who may be able to make the transition to safety.
Bottom-line is whatever it is we do we just have to MAKE SURE Crocker does NOT see the field next year.
I can't understand this organizations ineptitude in regards to the safety position.
What do you do when there's no way out? Find a way to get deeper in it.
its called not giving out to much information before the draft
we don’t want any teams trading up to take a prospect we are looking at. Kinda like when the the jags (i believe it was the jags) traded up and took the DT that we were looking to get but we had to settle for Keith Rivers a few years ago.
AMAS
saints
Traded up infront of us and got the usc tackle I believe.
by JCompton41 on Jan 12, 2012 12:48 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
jags did it too
1 7 New Orleans Saints Sedrick Ellis DT USC Pac-10 from San Francisco via New England
1 8 Jacksonville Jaguars Derrick Harvey DE Florida SEC from Baltimore
1 9 Cincinnati Bengals Keith Rivers LB USC Pac-10
"the bengals are not a west of the 104 longitude team."
so we should be thanking the jags is what youre saying
by JCompton41 on Jan 12, 2012 1:29 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
dunno, mixed blessing
derrick harvey or keith rivers..
"the bengals are not a west of the 104 longitude team."
rivers gets way more hate than he deserves
The guy has atleast been solid his whole career, just not a big play maker. Harvey was a bust to the fullest extent.
by JCompton41 on Jan 12, 2012 1:40 PM EST via mobile up reply actions 1 recs
+1
the draft is the ultimate bullsh___ game amongst teams….we seem to do horribly at this category…..Is it just me or does everyone on the planet know our pick ever year???see Jets = Derrelle Revis
"In a battle between patience and power, patience always wins"
by ticalcaldwell on Jan 12, 2012 12:54 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
It definately is a calculated game
you can kinda tell when coaches talk up a certain player and then never even look at them when its time to draft. I think the top 5 picks are pretty predictable but outside of that, its a crap shoot. And you don’t know what GM/Owner is making or taking calls from other teams for trades, thats always is a wild card.
AMAS
I think this is another area in which we've improved,
but 2011 wasn’t great. Everyone knew we wanted Green and Dalton, but Green didn’t matter so much, because nobody was trading into the top 3 to get him, and nobody already in the top 3 was ever considering him. We got lucky that nobody else took Dalton.
But Gresham in 2009 wasn’t really telegraphed. It was widely known that we had a need at tight end, but there wasn’t any particular indication that we’d take him, iirc.
Andy Dalton: An American Hero
by Pardon_My_French on Jan 12, 2012 2:12 PM EST up reply actions
part of what accounts for "knowing our pick ahead of time"
Is bc our weaknesses are clearly defined (read:GLARING) our roster is simply not at the point where teama like the ravens and steelers are where you can just re-load and add depth or go BPA if need be
The Curse of Bo Jackson: Jan 13th,1991- present day
by TruWhoDey on Jan 13, 2012 12:28 AM EST via iPhone app up reply actions
I meant not only with this report, but with the past decade.
When’s the last time we had a decent safety?
What do you do when there's no way out? Find a way to get deeper in it.
Never had it in the last twenty years..possibly Daryl Williams
I used to love Fulcher,at that time we also had Ricky Dixon, solly and Barney Bussey was a very good special teamer,jeez ray horton played a bit too. ahhh the late 80’s!
David Fulcher
best strong safety in team history probably.
Tommy Casanova the best free safety.
by occams_tiger_teeth on Jan 12, 2012 9:00 PM EST up reply actions
There is no way I would draft anyone from Notre Dame's secondary.
They are atrocious…
Nothing in the draft is a sure thing. Everyone was drooling over Taylor Mays in the draft and he has been a bust so far.
by D-Day77 on Jan 12, 2012 12:42 PM EST via iPhone app reply actions
i wouldn't call him a bust just yet
but I wouldn’t put all of our eggs in one basket either. There is nothing wrong drafting a projected starter for the SS postion to get a little competition going. You can never have enough depth.
AMAS
not saying he won't be a good player
But hasn’t done anything yet. I hope he turns into a stud. He has all of the physical tools to be great.
by D-Day77 on Jan 12, 2012 1:13 PM EST via iPhone app up reply actions
for sure
i think they just need to simplify it for him. He is either blitzing or playing man on the TE. Mays that is.
AMAS
he needs to be smart to be a saftey
We can’t have our last line of defense being someone who’s robotic. I think he has a chance to be a good player, I don’t think they can coach him up in his coverage skills, just has to be smart enough to make up for his lack of being fluid. Roy Williams can be a good saftey for zimmer so can Mays, just needs to know football.
by JCompton41 on Jan 12, 2012 1:39 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
I swear I am baffled that he can't cover...
He has amazing speed. He must not be able to change direction worth a crap, takes bad angles, or something. I have never had the chance to study him.
by D-Day77 on Jan 12, 2012 1:47 PM EST via iPhone app up reply actions
from what I heard was the no changing directions
And I don’t think that can be changed with coaching.
by JCompton41 on Jan 12, 2012 1:57 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Sometimes I think
The perception of him not being able to cover is just everyone buying into Mel Kiper and ESPN/Scouts Inc scouting reports. I remember him @ USC and he was bad in coverage at all, sometime a little over aggressive but he could cover pretty well. I think the real issue is getting him fully acclamated to Zimmers system and scheme, enough where Zimmer feels comfortable putting him in there full time. If there is one knock I have about Zimmer, it’s his refusal to bench Crocker because he knows his system so well.
I remember
the play in the pre-season that he got hurt on against Indy, he chased the receiver all they way across the field and caught him from behind, personally he made one heck of a change of direction on that play, hopefully we see more of the same in the future.
personally
I don’t want to see Marvin fired, I want him to be promoted to G.M. while handing the reigns over to Zimmer as head coach and hiring Jack Del Rio as Defensive Coordinator. Who Dey!!!
by joeb69 on Jan 9, 2012 8:18 PM EST replyactions 2 recs
well you have to put your players in a position to win
for taylor mays, if he has to think, it takes away from his athletic ability. I bet Mays would still be hard to stop even if you knew he was blitzing. He would be to quick for a TE or LT going around the edge and he should be able to bull rush most RBs. And if he knows its man up on the TE, it will be less to think about and he can just focus on smothering the TE. IMO
AMAS
if the case is that he cant think fast enough to play
Then he shouldn’t be playing. This is the NFL, you have to be more than athletic to get by. Then if Mays is covering a te, like the offense will know he’s doing, they a. Run him away from the play or b. Do double moves and burn him.
by JCompton41 on Jan 12, 2012 2:09 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Running an amazing 40 doesnt indicare field speed, mays problem like alot of Big guys is stiff hips
Prevent you getting out that backpedal quickly,slows done your change of direction: pretty much essential when covering a reciever: Coaches want to see guys open thier hips and explode to the spot. Taylors great straight back,or straight forward,chang of direction is the issue. USC played him in the box to enforce the run, or way deep in passing situations so he could run forward to the spot,closer to the line and picking up a slot or crossing guy gave him probs. Zimmer and Coyle will be teaching the technique…if he gets it wow great. But for all those monsterous physical traits hopefully he can harness the teckers to succeed.
Yep!!
Mays needs to refine his technique. and maybe stick with me now ok …..do some yoga or pilattes in the offseason, Ti chi something to give him more of a fluid motion. There are drils also that can be preformed but it takes a lot of reps for them to come natural.
It can happen though…
by Craig Da Dread on Jan 12, 2012 10:19 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah, its to early to call him a bust
This was only the kids second year in the league. His first being under a HC that had the whole team playing like crap. Look at the turn around they made after firing him and no major changes in personnel. We got him with no off season and coming into a new system. When he got here it was close to to the start of the season so he really didn’t have time to learn anything and what he did learn was done on the fly. Once the season started and we were winning Zim probably thought it was a bad time to learn on the job during a playoff run.
He was all american 3 times at USC and had good stats for a db. At over 6ft and almost 240 he runs a 3.4 – 40. I remember he did have some knocks on him about how he did some coverage drills at the combine and there was talk of him playing OLB. That may not be out of question. Zim seems to be able to take athletes and make them players just look at the MJ experiment.
by Bigcatdaddy on Jan 12, 2012 4:41 PM EST via Android app up reply actions
Bengals don't use high picks on safety
won’t happen this year either IMHO given they have skill positions in need.
CB
WR
DE
RB
Then there is what happens if Pat Sims walks…almost have to burn a first rounder on a DT if a good one is still there. Then no way a safety is picked in round 1.
Then there is Collins, if he walks, do you really not address RT? No, you get one probably in the second round.
I expect they will address safety in FA. No way they just turn it over to Mays, Sands without competition in camp.
I would put RB at #2 on that list
and I think we will go guard in top three as well
"In a battle between patience and power, patience always wins"
by ticalcaldwell on Jan 12, 2012 1:03 PM EST up reply actions
this all depends on FA
my list will change after FA
"In a battle between patience and power, patience always wins"
by ticalcaldwell on Jan 12, 2012 1:10 PM EST up reply actions
I only listed skill positions.
We definitely need two new guards that play better than what we had and Bobbie Williams is 35 now, time to move on.
Kind of off topic
but not totally… Claiborne, Kirkpatrick and Richardson all declared
by Oregonbengalsfan on Jan 12, 2012 1:11 PM EST reply actions
Gruden got his last April
I’m thinking that Zimmer will get his this April with the first two picks going defense. By April Hall should be out of his walking boot and will begin to rehab a vastly shrunken leg. The Bengals doctors should know if he’s fitting the profile of returning to NFL status by September or October or if PUP is in his future. Might end up with two in the draft!
I would take it.
And I totally agree, it is Zimm’s turn to be the one with fingers crossed on draft day hoping what he had planned works out. Lord knows it worked for Gruden. Imagine next year us debating who should be rookie of the year for the Bengals, but this time it is two defensive guys!
Defense wins championships
If we just fix the o line I wouldn’t mind seeing the rest of the draft going to the defense. I could be happy as a TB or Balt type SB team. We already have more talent on offense than those 2 teams did.
by Bigcatdaddy on Jan 12, 2012 4:47 PM EST via Android app up reply actions
Josh - Coyle also stated that the secondary needs to create more turnovers . . .
Specifically, they need to have more than 10 picks (the lowest team total since the abysmal 2-14 2002 season).
Coyle’s direct quote from the interview: “We’ve got to create more turnovers. It was not a good year from the standpoint of interceptions.”
Coyle, in the same interview, went on to say, “We’ve got a good nucleus of players but it’s going to be important to continue to tab players in the draft and free agency.”
With turnovers in mind, we need a ballhawking safety who can generate turnovers. Michael Griffin of the Titans is a 2-time Pro Bowl safety (and 1st team All Pro in 2010) who has a knack of creating turnovers (17 INTs as a safety through his first 5 seasons in the league is VERY impressive, as well as many forced fumbles).
I’d do my best to re-sign Reggie Nelson, and then target Michael Griffin in FA. Plus, Griffin can play both safety positions, and we all know how much Marvin loves having safeties who can play FS and SS. Also, Griffin was selected with the very next pick after Leon Hall in the 2007 draft – kinda cool tidbit IMO.
by The_Black_Stripes on Jan 12, 2012 1:22 PM EST via mobile reply actions
Everyone in our division has at least one genuine playmaker in their seconday
Reed, Troy and Hayden all fit that description. They are guys who can be moved around and play instinctivly. These guys are pretty special and I think we need one of those guys in one of the CB or S positions. The rest need to be good but IMO one guy needs to be special. Some say Nelson might be that guy. Maybe, but I have not seen it soo far. He seems to lack discilpine as he seems to abandon his lanes too much. EX: the Ray Rice TD run in the first quarter of the last game. This is something that can be fixed, but if a guys is truly instinctive I am not sure that is something that should have to be fixed.
"If we always agree, one of us is not necessary"
I agree
With our d-line,it would be nice to have a ball hawking type of saftey
I have been interested in Sands,would like to see what he could do
Not that he is the answer
"A team is more than a group of individuals,its a group of individuals that come together to make a team"
If we land a couple of CB's.....
Why not move Clement over to safety?
by Stanley1 on Jan 12, 2012 2:35 PM EST reply actions 2 recs
We need two new safeties.
Don’t know why Nelson gets so much praise and haven’t made one big play all year. Yeah he probably was our best secondary player this year but that doesn’t mean much on our team. He didn’t stop any team from passing or running his way. I’ll sign Griffin before I re sign Nelson. And Crocker played horrible down stretch so I’m not buying that crap bout them 3guys being ready next year. Crocker had no business being out there at all. And all talk bout him knowing system is bull because he was out of position every play.
by pray4gm11 on Jan 12, 2012 2:47 PM EST via mobile reply actions
Which Reggie Nelson Were u watching?? the one in Jacksonville or the one in Cincy??
but hey i know what you mean, i know you want an impact Safety like a Ed Reed and a Troy, but come on give some time for Taylor Mays if not then we can always go get a S in 2013 NFL Draft
to be honest, i dont think Nelson got enough praise this year
Nelson had a few bad calls against him but still came up with a bunch of big hits. And he had few interceptions. I think the play of the SS kind of hurt nelson in coverage and run support but Nelson is pro bowl caliber player in this defense IMO
AMAS
I have to agree here
Crocker was a liability to Nelson and our corners.
by Oregonbengalsfan on Jan 12, 2012 2:54 PM EST up reply actions
I thought Nelson was a nice surprise this season.
And I would LOVE to see him back in stripes for a few more seasons. He did have some bad calls, but the guy can lay the wood.
yea that hit on heath miller was brutal even tho Heath still caught it
but the next pass to miller was bobbled and was interecpted by Hall, I beleive. So Nelson hits do have an impact. And if I remember correctly, Gore wasn’t in much or ran the same after Nelson hit him.
AMAS
He wasnt horrible but damn sure wasnt good
Free safeties are the ballhawks of defense. Nelson didn’t break up one pass all year, dropped multiple int, and got close to 5 late hit penalties. He’s a good player for depth in case of injury but he needs to be upgraded also.
by pray4gm11 on Jan 12, 2012 3:22 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
The penalties were BS
Reggie Nelson 2011 Season
85 Tackles
59 solo
26 assisted
2 sacks
2 FF
4 INTs (115yds 1 D)
PD 12
Stuffs 2
Not sure where you are getting your information…
by Oregonbengalsfan on Jan 12, 2012 3:37 PM EST up reply actions
further more
Troy Polamalu 2011 Season
90 Tackles
64 solo
27 assisted
1 sacks
0 FF
2 INTs (115yds 1 D)
PD 14
Stuffs 7
for those who think nelson is not worth franchising
AMAS
I love it!
Troy who? Lol. Nelson might not be a pro bowler but he sure as hell isn’t a liability. IMO he’s on the up and Troys on his way out. He can’t stay health for a full season and what good is it to have a killer safety when he’s on the bench. Nelson is just fine and we have more pressing needs to attend to than replacing him.
by Bigcatdaddy on Jan 12, 2012 4:55 PM EST via Android app up reply actions
U get them type stats on bad defense
Please don’t ever compare Nelson to troy my friend. Dhani led team in tackles two years do we compare him to Ray Lewis hell no. Nelson is solid but when u got bad tackling ur gonna get a lot of tackles from ur safety. Troy get how tackles in box like linebacker so its kinda hard to compare. Besides the big hits where the receiver still caught ball how many game changing WOW plays Nelson have. Teams fear throwing Troy way don’t NO team fear Nelson in no part of his game. And he’s FREE on every play u better make something happen.None of his int’s changed the game but every time he dropped one the team either scored or one of our players get hurt on that series.
by pray4gm11 on Jan 12, 2012 5:03 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
thats not necessarly true because he could just be a sure tackler and he makes up the difference from the LBs and SS missed tackles
AMAS
I need more out my free safety than to just be sure tackler
I’ll re sign him but I also wouldnt mind seeing us go after someone to at least challenge him for spot.
by pray4gm11 on Jan 12, 2012 9:27 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
No comparison
I just stated that I though troy was on his down side and Nelson was getting better. I also stated that we had more pressing needs. Nelson will be just fine for at least another year. You can’t have pro bowlers at every position. Not even your steelers have that. ;-)
by Bigcatdaddy on Jan 12, 2012 5:18 PM EST via Android app up reply actions
a bad defense? or 7th overall defense....
The Curse of Bo Jackson: Jan 13th,1991- present day
by TruWhoDey on Jan 13, 2012 12:42 AM EST via iPhone app up reply actions
I don't even know where to start
But your making it sound like one of our most consistent players in the secondary is our biggest liability….Nelson was literally one of the only bright spots in the secondary when you look at the full season body of work
The Curse of Bo Jackson: Jan 13th,1991- present day
by TruWhoDey on Jan 13, 2012 12:45 AM EST via iPhone app up reply actions
it was reggies prob in jax..
he’s just a bonehead,.. freak athlete who cant stop making errors
nice comparison
While Nelson is no Troy, no matter what the stats say, he’s at least a pretty good play maker.
by JCompton41 on Jan 12, 2012 5:07 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Big time players show up in big games point blank period!!!
by pray4gm11 on Jan 12, 2012 8:41 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Pray4gm11
Do you not like Nelson ?
You should just say so … The proof has been presented to you
and you still do not smell how good the wing sauce is.
The secondary as a whole did not get too many picks he still lead
said secondary in INT’s.
He lays the lumber..
Crocker missed easy pickens tooo one lead to a score in the playoff game.
Nelson had a season that you could say was on pace with or a hair (pardon the pun) better than troys , what does he have to do come to your house and cut off his dreads and tell you sorry he didnt live up to your standards?
c-mon man!!!
by Craig Da Dread on Jan 12, 2012 10:48 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
none of those penalties were late hits
They were either unnecessary roughness,helmet to helmet, or hitting a defenseless receiver….watched very snap an as far as his penalties for those hits, a strong case could be made that every one of those was a botched call (not just bc I’m a homer either)
The Curse of Bo Jackson: Jan 13th,1991- present day
by TruWhoDey on Jan 13, 2012 12:41 AM EST via iPhone app up reply actions
I Agree AMAS85
Nelson had the pick 6 this year forced fumbles numerous big hits.
Bogus calls by bad refs and bad rule changes made being able to make a difference
impossible on Nelsons behalf.
He played run support he did a lot of things.
last few days of pro bowl voting I checked out his stats compared to others and you could arguably vote him in.
I looked at it as if he was not a Bengal and he still stood out,yeah he had some blown coverages but to me he was still solid.
Tell you what you didnt go loafing as a wr making a catch in his area, because he would clean you up!!!
by Craig Da Dread on Jan 12, 2012 10:37 PM EST up reply actions
Nelson has his issues but they are probably fixable. He is kind of like Rey in a way
He has all of the physical tools and you can see he loves the game. He just needs to be a bit more discilpined. He deserts his lanes toom much and has given up big plays as a result. If he improves from here somewhat I will be happy with him and that is possibly one fewer position we need to be concerned about. I think he can and has the talent to be a playmaker but guys like Reed and Troy, the prototypical playmakers, work in a D that allows for them to move around the field. Zim’s D is dependant on keeping his players in their area of responsibility. It doesn’t allow for freelancing.I am not down on Nelson but I am not confident in him yet either. It will all depend on how he progresses. Plus it is true that Crockers poor play has something to do with it and it affects Jones as well. He has made Jones look bad on several occasions though I will admit Jones was bad at times..
"If we always agree, one of us is not necessary"
We all get on Simpson for his production
But only two guys on defense were better than he was on offense. Everybody on defense had a bad year but Atkins and Fanane.
by pray4gm11 on Jan 12, 2012 3:26 PM EST via mobile reply actions
You guys give players too much credit
They all were solid but mind had there wow he
dominate moments. I watch every game every second so I really don’t look at stats. So throw stats out window with me.
Howard- although was upgrade over Dhani Jones but still missed tackles and for beat by almost every tight end.
Clements- please he made a couple decent plays but also got beat way too much for me. teams had there way with him on 3rd downs.
Johnson,Peko,Ruckers- come on now too many games you didn’t even know they were playing.
Nelson- I’ll put him on list. Gotta give him a Lil credit he was best player on worst secondary in NFL.
by pray4gm11 on Jan 12, 2012 5:19 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Howard was Wlb and Jones was Mlb
You don’t even know who plays where and we didn’t have the worst secondary in the league. To be banged up all season they did pretty good. I would like better and it probably will be but dang man your just raging on every player that put on a Bengals uni.
by Bigcatdaddy on Jan 12, 2012 5:26 PM EST via Android app up reply actions
once again ur on stats not watching
Only one starter got hurt all year in secondary. We bought in Howard to basically do what Jones couldn’t do and that’s cover tight end. Not raging just saying if we want Mike Brown to changed we as fans gotta stop settling for less. Crocker was horrible yes but who else was that much better in secondary? Name me one player in secondary that was good in pass defense? Howard got abused all year by tight end and Hall wasn’t shutting nobody down either. Our d-line carried us all year by applying pressure. We all seen it when Simms and Dunlap got hurt. We were beating teams with our depth. Honestly we can upgrade every position on our defense besides Johnson, Dunlap, and Atkins.
by pray4gm11 on Jan 12, 2012 5:51 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
It's not stats, it's position
Jones played middle linebacker. That position hardly ever covers the TE. Howard took Rivers place at Weak side linebacker. That position plays on the weak side of the field (the side with out the TE). How ever with some offensive formations the TE is on his side. Mostly the coverage of TE falls on the Strong side linebacker which is Lawson, Moch, and Johnson at times. I know what your trying to say though (I think).
by Bigcatdaddy on Jan 12, 2012 6:02 PM EST via Android app up reply actions
I watch games
Jones from his MLB position was on the tight end a lot LAST YEAR. Lawson or Moch was here last year and Johnson was only at olb for bout two games last year. Out if all our linebackers LAST YEAR Jones played most in coverage. He never came off feild.
by pray4gm11 on Jan 12, 2012 6:18 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
lol
I guess next ur gonna say Crocker was a SS his job is mainly run support so that wasn’t him getting beat in coverage.
by pray4gm11 on Jan 12, 2012 6:21 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
OMG!
Do you think that players only have one set thing that they do or just one responsibility? Hell Dunlap might cover the TE in a zone blitz and yes Crockers position is suppose to help in run support. That doesn’t mean he isn’t suppose to cover also. Look don’t take this the wrong way but I’m going to tell you what I told my 6th grade team, go buy a Madden video game. Seriously, I’m sure you know football but you get a little mixed up on positions and it will help.
by Bigcatdaddy on Jan 12, 2012 6:34 PM EST via Android app up reply actions
????
I’ve never said Jones played Mlb just thought u watch bengals games. Last year Jones covered TE most times, this year Howard covered TE most times. Neither is all that good covering TE so where is Howard due all this credit. Howard didn’t play any better this year than Rivers or Rey played last year. Jones was MLB last year than Rey was thia year. Marvin hyped him up a little bit when he said he was most athletic linebacker he ever coached. If that’s really case we should see something special next year with off season work Zimmer.
by pray4gm11 on Jan 12, 2012 6:50 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
I'm just messing with you ;-)
I was just responding to when you said Howard was an upgrade or replacement for Jones and to be honest I’ve gotten myself confused. It’s all in fun.
by Bigcatdaddy on Jan 12, 2012 7:00 PM EST via Android app up reply actions
MLB in pass coverage typically plays the middle of the field
Which might b why you think dhani jones “always covered the tight end”. In reality, dhani never covered the TEs which was everyone’s gripe about him…poor coverage skills. Just happened to be those poor coverage skills were usually exploited across the middle of the field (his responsibility more often than not) by a TE
The Curse of Bo Jackson: Jan 13th,1991- present day
by TruWhoDey on Jan 13, 2012 12:52 AM EST via iPhone app up reply actions
Pray4gm...
Your name should be pray for glasses or a reality check.
Stats aside you say you watched the games,did you watch the whole games?
did you watch what was the scheme who was to do what and who really got beat
who didn’t and why .
The worst defender by far was Jennings, his name should be at the top of your list for one.
The D-line had a rotation that was scary, they kept putting in a fresh guy, the loss of Simms hurt more than a lot of people know , Attkins is a figgin monster who got ripped off and should have made the pro bowl he pretty much lead the league for DT’s in sacks,he ran down plays he pressured QBs!!!
You do realize that the Defense finished with a #7 ranking out of 32 teams …My math says thats Damn good. I think they were like 11th against the pass,once again outta 32 teams thats:::: say it with me now….DAmn good ..
This team played as a unit ,and you are picking on said unit foryour own reasons..
If this defense did not play as they did, our offense that we all love that finished 20th overall ok we would not have won as many games with out that worst secondary as you say in the NFL….
Please if you watch the games really watch because there are people who wait for someone to make a mistake while watching then spend the next quarter and a half complaining about it and miss what really goes on in the game….
Don’ t be “that guy”..
by Craig Da Dread on Jan 12, 2012 11:11 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
"dang man your just raging on every player that put on a Bengals uni."
BINGO! Give it a rest pray
by Oregonbengalsfan on Jan 12, 2012 5:35 PM EST up reply actions
Not even true
Do you even watch the games or look stuff up?
by Oregonbengalsfan on Jan 12, 2012 3:37 PM EST up reply actions
Reggie Nelson was pretty good
Yes he missed some plays but if you look around the league you will see that with anyone playing safety. Redskins fans complain about LaRon Landry getting beat and missing tackles, even the Steelers talk about Troy getting beat too much for being overly aggressive. It comes with the position of playing DB if you screw up you are the last line of defense and there is (ussually) no one there to cover your a$$ so your mistakes get magnified. Overall Reggie did pretty well, Chris Crocker on the hand was 100% absolutley positively horrible this year!!!!
If we re-sign Nelson...
…I don’t see a problem with giving Mays and Sands every opportunity to win starting spots.
On the issue of how the Bengals use their safeties—-the Marvin/Zim model has been pretty consistent—you need to very good corners to take away opponents #1 and #2 options. Safeties are primarily their as enforcers, run support, and blitzers. There isn’t anything wrong with the model, so long as you have the right guys.
like a said before
I think it would be a mistake to put all your eggs in one basket, I would draft a playmaking SS and the will put the bengals defense over the edge.
AMAS
If past actions are indicators of future behavior...
…it’s more likely that the Bengals will sign a couple journeymen free agents to fortify the roster rather than spending a top draft pick on a safety.
I get your point, but I think we have other priorities with our first pick.
i thought so too until the playoff game
Our Dline sets the mood of the game and create pretty resonable push that allow LBs and DBs to fill each hole. Our strong saftey is consistanly getting his gap blown up and lets the RB to run through or around him for big gains. This is a big problem, we don’t necessarly need an all star SS but if we do get a chance to pick a play making SS, we have to take him. We had plenty of INTs or tackle for losses that were missed because of poor SS play.
AMAS
I agree 100%
I also like idea of drafting Barron. With the way the league is now u safeties on feild more. Tight ends are too fast for linebackers and too big for corners. We have toys to play with on defense we just need a couple play makers that make everyone around them better.
by pray4gm11 on Jan 12, 2012 5:40 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
im with you
I wouldn’t mind if Barron is there and the best player on the board, but don’t think we reach for someone if he’s gone. Not sure anybody we get later is better than Mays or Sands would be. As long as we keep Nelson, I don’t want Mays and Sands both the starters. We need one guy back there we can count on
by JCompton41 on Jan 12, 2012 5:04 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
we do not need safteys in fa
if you look normally the bengals dont have traditional safteys they have hard hitters and people who can blitz. We need a number 1 cb to cover the reciever which could make hall better and clements. Finally we need a good guard because our line sucks all the runs were getting stoped and everytime andy droped back the pressure was coming from the middle.
by bengalsfanforlife on Jan 12, 2012 4:54 PM EST reply actions
I think when it comes time for pick #1
they should pick the best defensive back either a S or a CB because they can use either one. A free agent safety? Not sure who’s out there. Whitner would have been a good signing.
by occams_tiger_teeth on Jan 12, 2012 9:08 PM EST reply actions
Taylor mays
I think we all will be happy with mays next year. He was the number 1 rated player at the beginning of his senior season till he got hurt. Stella will get his groove back.

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